Is it OK to Use CBD Oil in My Dental Office to Help My Patients?

Is it OK to Use CBD Oil in My Dental Office to Help My Patients’ With Their Anxiety?

By May 17, 2019Episodes

CBD oil is everywhere. In case you are not familiar with it, CBD is extracted from a variety of the cannabis (marijuana) plant, but it does not contain THC. And since there is no psychoactive component, it is legal all across the United States. Many are using it to combat anxiety, to help get a better night’s sleep, for pain issues and much more. But is it OK to recommend that our patients use it for anxiety in the dental office? This is a question that was sent in to The Dental Practice Fixers, so please listen to what Dr. Richard Madow and Dr. David Madow have to say. Then of course we do the call of the week. We call an office asking a fairly simple question – I need a lot of dental treatment and do you accept Care Credit? Fairly straightforward, right? Well you must hear this response! If you have a question that you would like answered on our podcast, please send it in to podcast@madow.com. We will do our best to get yours answered!


Is it OK to Use CBD Oil in My Dental Office to Help My Patients’ With Their Anxiety?

 Female Speaker 1: The Dental Practice Fixers Podcast is brought to you by The Madow Center for Dental Practice Success. To find out how we can help increase the success of your practice, checkout madow.com or call us at 1-800-258-0060.
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: CBD Oil, what is it all about? Is this something we need to know more about? Is it something we could be prescribing to our patients to help with anxiety or other issues? Is it something maybe the dentists and hygienists should be using for crown prep? I'm not so sure but we're going to explore some of these questions and, of course, much more in Episode 13 Season 2 of The Dental Practice Fixers Podcast. I'm Dr. Richard Madow here with my co-host, cohort, business partner, brother, and co-trouble maker, Dr. David Madow. How are you doing today, Dave? [Crosstalk] How are you doing today, Dave?  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: How is it going? I'm doing fantastic. How are you doing, Rich?  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Doing great, glad to be here. I just want to real quickly thank everybody for all the positive comments that we've been getting about The Dental Practice Fixers Podcast. Tell your friends, give us some good ratings, do whatever it takes. We're growing and growing and growing and we really appreciate it and also send in your questions. Speaking of that, we've got an interesting question today. Don't we?
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: We do and I'm going to go and read it because it's one that we've never actually gotten before. So let's get right into it, Rich. The question is, Dear Dental Practice Fixers.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: It's us.  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: [Laughs] What do you guys think of CBD oil? But it goes further like there's more, it's more than just that.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Okay.
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: She said, I am considering using CBD oil in my practice on one of my patients to alleviate anxiety and maybe some other issues. What do you guys think? Is this a good idea? Signed, Anonymous.   
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: I'm just curious, Dave. Do you know where Anonymous is located?  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: [Laughs].  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: It wasn't a joke. I mean, sometimes [crosstalk] why not because sometimes I know when I read the questions many times, I anonymize them by their request but actually go to their name and location. So that's not the case here?
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Okay. No, no, yeah, I didn't know. I thought it was joke, you know, where anonymous is generally located. Okay. I do know where this anon- okay, I do know where this anonymous originates. I'm going to... to not [inaudible 02:44] on some particular areas, is it okay if we just say Maryland?  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Okay. Well, that's an area, Maryland.   
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Let's say it's a female dentist in Maryland. Good enough?  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Okay. Then, there are several thousand. Perfect. No, I was just curious what part of the country because obviously different parts of country have different attitudes towards-
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Yeah, that's a good point.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: CBD oil, medical marijuana, all kinds of issues. So I think it's interesting to know that.  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: That's a great point. So we got to answer this question.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Okay [crosstalk]. What's your take? Go ahead, give your take on it.
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: I still... let me think. The question is first of all, Dental Practice Fixers, what do you guys think of CBD oil? So if we just take that part of the question only and nothing else, whether it should be used in the dental practice or not. I happen to be a fan... I personally happen to be a fan of CBD oil. I've done a lot of reading on it. I've actually used it over one year plus personally. I didn't say I personally used it personally but if I did, I did make sense. But-  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Yeah, you're not supposed to smoke it.  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: [Laughs] Well, actually it's very interesting, Rich. I think there's three ways to actually take it and one would be not really smoking but one would be vaping. Now, I'm not a fan of inhaling any kind of crazy stuff into my lungs or anybody else's lungs so I don't vape CBD. I don't really believe in vaping, first of all. But the other two ways are to eat it in edibles and then make it with like cookies or gummy bears into some sort of edible. And the other way, the third way is probably the most common way; is to you have it like, you know in an oil-based or water-soluble liquid and just put a few drops in your mouth. If it's oil basically on your tongue, if it's water-based, you just swallow it. Now, Rich let's back up for one second because we might have some viewers and listeners that don't even know what we're talking about, CBD oil, well, what is that? So CBD oil, if I can get this right, it stands for Cannabidiol, CBD. It is totally legal everywhere in the United States. It is not marijuana. I repeat that, it is not marijuana. But so it's not psychoactive, it doesn't get you high. Go ahead, Rich.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: I was going to say it's actually so mainstream. I'm sure some of our listeners received this as well. I just received a Bed Bath & Beyond catalog and it had CBD oil on the back cover, big displays, get your CBD oil. I'm guessing it was in the Beyond section but that's, you know, [laughs]. I mean, you can even get it in Bed Bath & Beyond so that's pretty mainstream. 20% off, you feel fine.
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Please, did they have 20% off coupons? I can't remember that.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: No, lend me some money.  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: It's funny Rich, I was with the family in Jackson before. We went into some juice place and just juice and smoothies. And one of the options in your smoothie was they could put like, I don't know if that's the right word but like a CBD oil in the smoothie for like a few extra bucks. It was very interesting. It's pretty much like you said: Bed Bath & Beyond, smoothie shop, it's really everywhere.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Right. And the point being, it's legal, it's somewhat mainstream. It doesn't get you stoned, your patient, you know, you're not going to want to take some and lessen the pain. I mean, there's nothing wrong with some.
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Well, maybe you can [crosstalk].  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: So maybe and I think it's a really good idea that you brought it up for people that aren't that familiar with it. It's not a narcotic in any way, it's not classified and it's not psychoactive or changes your frame of mind. You're not going to see triangles when you taste, nothing like that.  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: But just to make sure our viewers and listeners know this, it is part of the hemp plant but it's... they're different like I guess varieties and the hybrid may not be the right word but they're different in varieties and it's a variety that is very, very high in CBD and extremely low in THC so there's no, again, no psychoactive component.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Correct, correct. So what's your opinion?
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: So my opinion is I've been using CBD oil for the past, over a year. It really helps, it's a great calming effect that if I ever have... if I'm like anxious for a day or if I have trouble getting to sleep or anything like that or I want to have like a really good night’s sleep, I find that it really, really does work. Now again, I know it's anecdotal on one person. I really do believe that it works. I won't take something to be so popular and have no effect at all. I've been reading and watching a tremendous number of videos about it. I mean, I think it's actually even better than [inaudible 07:42]. I think it's a lot better than [crosstalk]. But it's old Rich and I have talked about an [inaudible 07:49] product that.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: It's funny that you said because I was going to bring that [crosstalk].  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: I did that on purpose.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: I was going to bring [crosstalk]. Oh really, okay, because you know my opinion?
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Well, I really don't know. I have a feeling I know your opinion but I don't know your opinion for sure. And of course, you can always say there's a placebo effect, you always say if somebody tells you this is going to calm you down and it will. I don't know, I mean, I definitely found it to help me and while I'm sleeping, my body doesn't know if it's a placebo or not and it really does help me get a better night’s sleep. I really found that.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: I disagree with that. I feel your body totally knows it's a placebo. I got to say first of all, just, you know, in general I know we're here to give our opinions. I have nothing against CBD oil, I have nothing against, you know, responsible use of medicinal or recreational marijuana or alcohol or anything like that. I think that, you know, things used by responsible people that do things the way you're supposed to do it and don't go driving on it. I've no problem with any of that stuff. But I do have a feeling that... I just feel like every few years, something else comes along. This is the big thing that when you look at CBD oil, if you look it up, there are people claiming that it cures everything. I mean, yeah, anxiety, insomnia, herpes, diabetes, heart problems, cancer, the list goes on and on and on and I just felt like it's the same kind of thing when some... there's some high top MLM and they've developed this proprietary formula of only the small, you know, grain that's in the rice paddies, they're only in a certain area of Thailand and that they've distilled in a certain way, and it cures everything. I am putting CBD oil in this category. I get very skeptical when there are claims that something does too much. And honestly, and I don't want to offend anyone here, I feel the same way about chiropractic. You know, I'm sure there's some fantastic knowledgeable chiropractors out there but if you talk to many chiropractors, oh yeah, chiropractic cures this, this, this, heart disease, diabetes, hypertension, all kinds of aches and pains, fibromyalgia, Lyme disease and all these, just come and we crack your back and it actually cures everything. Not so sure I'm a believer. The chiropractor has its place for certain, you know, the care of the spine. Well, I certainly hope so but, you know, you talk to chiropractors and they say it takes care of everything. And I'm a big believer in the placebo effect. I think it's the same with so many medications. I think, you know, … over the counter in some medications. You know, I've heard people say that you take a tiny sliver of one and they slept through the night. Well, hey, I get very skeptical when there are too many claims for one product. 
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Well, you know, Rich, when I first started talking about CBD oil today though, I only talked about pain and anxiety. I don't know about anything else, about diabetes, high blood pressure, heart disease, I don't know and I won't even comment on that. I don't know but I found having some ski injuries and sometimes some, you know, I like to be calmer, I found that it definitely works for me. Now, it's been... this is a fact, this is not... it's a fact that we do have receptors in the human body, receptors that the CBD of the cannabidiol binds to. We have receptors and, you know, I think believe it or not, I think it's absolutely been proven that marijuana, THC, can help with anxiety and pain. I mean, I think that it's documented in many studies. And as CBD is very similar except it doesn't get you high, that's the main difference actually.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Well, what the hell good is it? 
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Honestly, I'm going to tell you there's another little side-story, it's a little personal but it's something that's really weird and it might not be related at all, but it's a very interesting story. A couple years ago, I noticed some weird things. I thought it was like just [inaudible 11:46] on the bottom of one of my feet. It turned out it was like I think there's warts and I don't know, I mean, it's not uncommon but I went to my dermatologist and she applied all these different things for like over a period of a year and like nothing got better and there's definitely not, it doesn't hurt or anything except, you know, other people can catch them if I'm like at a public bath or showers, something like that.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: [Crosstalk] Public baths and showers to begin with.  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Tell me about it. Now that I know all that stuff, it's true, you're right. But I am... I tried all this different stuff my dermatologist recommend, not only topical stuff but stuff by mouth and like nothing did it, nothing helped and I was trying all this crazy BS. Coincidentally, that's how I started using CBD oil like I'm going to say I don't even have a good feel for this one but I'm going to say like six months later roughly. I touched the bottom of my foot that had the warts and it's like everything is totally gone. Now, I'm not saying it was CBD, trust me, I know it's not scientific as anecdotal but all I'm saying is it's the only thing I changed in my life. [Crosstalk].  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Okay. So here we go, now, you're talking about exactly what I was saying. Okay, yeah, it's good for anxiety and restlessness but now it also cures foot warts. 
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: I didn’t say that. You're putting words on my mouth.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: You're saying there might be a connection between you using CBD and your foot warts going away.  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: I said, they may or they may not. If you rewind this, you rewind this and you watch where I said it, this maybe had nothing to do with the story. I said, it may have nothing but coincidentally that's when my foot warts went away. I don't know what to say.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: If it's coincidentally, then it had nothing to do with it. [Crosstalk].
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: All I'm saying is I don't know the answer. I don't know... I can't take a stand because I don't know the answer  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: You're saying, it's possible that CBD oil cures foot warts?  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: I'll say it's possible.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Okay.
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: It is possible.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Okay, exactly my point. And you talk to somebody else and they had, you know, nasal palate cured. You talked to somebody else there [crosstalk].  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: I've totally forgot to tell you about that too.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: You talked to somebody else, they had a French accent and all the sudden, they don't anymore. And it's also possible. I mean-
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: You are sick, you're sick.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Okay, here's what I'm going to say and maybe we should move on to the call. So yeah, of course, I feel like it's kind of on point so please get your final say. I know the famous article in the Atlantic which we all thought was total bullshit. Really it takes a dentist to task for not really being resource-based, evidence-based, using scientific studies a lot and let's face it, I don't think there are totally legit research-based, evidence-based scientific studies on CBD oil but it showed it does all these things including insomnia, anxiety, all these things. I think it is pretty much anecdotal at this point. So, if you recommend that to your patient, are you going down that rabbit hole of being non-scientific, being that non-scientific dentist who just, you know, is recommending things that are not evidence-based. I'm not so sure. I think if I were to talk about it to a patient, I might want to say I've nothing against it. If you feel it works well for you, feel free to use CBD oil before your dental appointments. When it comes to dentists recommending it to anxious patients as a proactive measure, I'm not so sure I'm buying it.  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Well, we got the same opinion there because I think part two of the question was this dentist, she's asking if she should use it in her office for anxious patients? My answer would be the same as yours. I'm not so sure; first of all, it will be totally legal because you can get it over the counter anywhere, you will be saying like to a patient, "take this Advil before treatment to help this pain," over the counter. But I do agree [crosstalk].  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Proven to work.
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Okay, but Rich, I'm agreeing with you. I'm agreeing with you, remember. I'm not so sure, only on part two, part one, totally that’s great. But I'm not so sure dentists should be giving out CBD in their offices. By the way, this dentist, kind of a side note that wrote those questions is totally into some type of... again, I wish we had more time to talk about this but there's some type of multi-level marketing thing in dentistry for dentists with CBD oil and they're recommending, you know, you get this and give this to all your patients and get your patients on that. I don’t agree with any multi-level at all.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: I'm not surprised, I'm so not surprised. Multi-level, maybe there's a topic for a different episode but multi-level deals in snake oil in my opinion and just about it, not all but maybe.  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Well, not all but here's the thing Rich. In the beginning of the show, you said that this is kind of like the flavor of the week or every couple of years, there's something new that comes out. This is 2019 and we're recording this in mid-2019. CBD oil has been around for a while, it's not new. I'm willing to bet that we look at this five years from now, somebody pulls out this podcast in five years. I think CBD oil is going to be totally around, very popular and it's not going anywhere. That's my opinion, it's my bet, it's not going away at all.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Okay, I disagree. I think they have a …but I think its stature as this cure-all, do all everywhere. I think it's going to be not as popular but what can we say [crosstalk]. Gone now will be gone but, you know, most [crosstalk] are gone but I think-
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: I think it also kind of parallels Canada's culture like, you know, cannabis is becoming legal in more and more states. As that becomes more legal for medical or recreational, the cannabis may still be like CBD but CBD is sold everywhere. I don't think it's going anywhere, man. I think it's going to be like [crosstalk].  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Hey, man.  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: You won't get into like probably get convenience stores and they sell it and I would never use this stuff, never. But like the tablets that keep you awake, you know, all that stuff. I think, you know, especially with [inaudible 18:02] everywhere. I think CBD is going to be one of those things that it's everywhere and it's not going away.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: I totally agree with that. I totally agree but I think, you know, I'm not sure if this is a good analogy but let's say for example, 10 years ago, everybody was recommending fish oil supplements and you can still get them anywhere but I don't think they're nearly as popular because I think it’s shown that it wasn't the cure all for everything, for inflammation, for heart disease that it was once found to be. And I think everybody seems to recognize now that it's better to eat it as part of eating fish; that does more than taking fish oil supplements and it was kind of overhyped and overrated. It still has its place among some people and I feel that's kind of the same with CBD.
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: So fish oil supplements are still very popular.   
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: They kind of had... I think they're not what they once were. They were the cure all 10 years ago. Every fish oil supplements do everything.  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Okay, let's leave it on that Rich.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: I think we're going to have to meet... we're going to make a plan to meet up 5 years from now. I'm proposing 3PM, March 18th, 5 years from now, we'll meet at the equator.
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Okay, let's do that and I'll tell you something. Let's also put some money on the CBD oil. I'm going to put a lot of money on my bet that it's going to still be tremendous.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Oh that's kind of an opinion what tremendous is.  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: I know. So we deliver that then?  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Yeah, we'll check back in a few years. I think when they came to the end now as far as dentists actually recommending it in their practice, our opinion is kind of [inaudible 19:38] and together a bit and get closer to one another. So great question from Dr., what was that? heranomous? No, Anonymous. It's heranomous splash in Maryland. Keep your questions coming, podcast.madow.com. We'd love to hear from you.
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: So Rich before we get into today's call, we've got a couple special, really special announcements, right?  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Yeah, sure, go ahead. I've got one too, you go first. You go first.  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Oh you want me to start? I know you have a real special one so I'm going to go really, really quickly because Rich and I mentioned this during every episode, we both believe in both of these things I'm going to mention really quickly. Our Masterclass which we get people into our Center For Dental Practice Success in Baltimore. We do a full day with you. We limit it to dentists, a small group of dentists. By the end of the day, we have shared with you a lot but in particular how we can help you to grow your dental practice. So check it out more, just go to masterclass.madow.com. If you're watching the video, it's right down there. If you're not watching the video, it's masterclass.madow, M-A-D-O-W.com. Secondly, if you are still doing your credit card processing, one of it in prehistoric ways. In other words, if you're not using Fattmerchant yet, get using Fattmerchant. Quickly, it's going to save you money every single month, which is simple. We guarantee, it will save you money every month. Why not do it? Go to... the link is right there. But if you're listening, bit.ly/fattmad, that's F-A-T-T-M-A-D. It's bit.ly/fattmad. Rich, take it away.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Thanks for saying really quickly. We know that a lot of our podcast listeners and watchers really don't know that much about us like who are we, who are these two guys? They've been coaching dentists for 30 years, they are dentists and blah, blah, blah. Well, what else have they done? One thing that amongst people that have been with us for a long time, we're really known for is TBSE, it stands for The Best Seminar Ever. It's the original Vegas multi-day, multi-speaker seminar. We didn’t name it The Best Seminar Ever, that would be kind of egotistical, I don't know what it will be but it used to be called The Super Fall Seminar when we started way back in 1995. People who attended year after year said we need to start calling this thing The Best Seminar Ever. How can we say no? So check it out, it's in Las Vegas, at the beautiful Tropicana Resort. It’s this November. It's two days, Friday and Saturday. And one thing different about TBSE is there are no breakout sessions. Everybody, docs and teams are in the same room the whole time. So check out tbse.com, The Best Seminar Ever. We've got some amazing speakers this year. Of course, I'll be there, Dave will be there. Maybe we will even do a live podcast from there. Who the heck knows, check out tbse.com. Got some fantastic speakers this year. Somebody who will be at TBSE for the first time and we just met, PeyRay, Dr. PeyRay, the guy is an amazing young clinician and kind of a teacher, a key opinion leader. We're excited about all our speakers but for some of you younger folks as they say, you might really be excited about him. So go to tbse.com. We'll see you in Vegas this November. Let's do our call.
  
 Female Speaker 2: For calling Dr. [Noise], Shirley speaking, may I help you?
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Yeah, hi Shirley. Can you tell me if you take CareCredit there?  
  
 Female Speaker 2: If we take what?  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: CareCredit, CareCredit, I think it's a way to finance my dental work because I think I got a lot of dental work that needs to be done.  
  
 Female Speaker 2: Okay. Can you hold while I check?
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Sure.  
  
 Female Speaker 2: All right then.  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Sure, thank you.  
  
 Female Speaker 2: Hello, no sir, we do not.
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: You don't take CareCredit. Okay, because I just know like I got a lot of stuff that needs to be done and I'm just trying to figure out how I can pay for it. But okay if you don't take it, thank you, thank you so much.  
  
 Female Speaker 2: What is your name?  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: My name is David.  
  
 Female Speaker 2: David and your last name?
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Michaels.  
  
 Female Speaker 2: Okay. All right. Well, did you need a lot of care from... did they tell you you need a lot of care here?  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: No, no, I'm just kind of new in town now. I haven't been to your office yet.  
  
 Female Speaker 2: Oh okay. All right. Okay. All right. Well, all right thank you for calling, David.
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Well, thank you so much. I appreciate all that.  
  
 Female Speaker 2: You're very welcome.  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Okay sure. Bye.  
  
 Female Speaker 2: All right. Bye.
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Okay. Can you believe that?   
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: I just put some question like what is it like to have a job and be so bad at that job? So bad.
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: You know, I thought she was going in the right direction, what's your name [crosstalk], somebody told you need a lot of work. What's that?  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Yes, she took a little pivot there at the end where she was about to redeem herself.
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: I know. She knows I needed a lot of work. What's your name? I thought she was going to take, have some, come on in and let's... but she said, okay, well, thank you very much.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Okay. Let's back up for a second. Who the hell doesn’t take CareCredit? Geez. It's like a requirement for the dental practice.  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: That is a good point. I mean, not to sound like [inaudible 25:12] that's been on the dental care well for a long time but that is a good point. It's a really good point.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Yeah, unbelievable and she had no idea what it was. So this office is, you know, not really well-informed. Put you on hold for a long time, no on-hold music or messaging at all which is always disconcerting because you're not sure if they hung up or not. 
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Right.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: And she kind of said, we do not and she was ready to let you go. But then as we said, she took that little pivot and asked for your name. But then, she thought well, you were diagnosed at her office and you needed a lot of treatment and since that wasn't the case, well, screw you, see you later. Wow, that was pretty unbelievable.  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: I don't know what else to say. I mean, I’m ready to give her my grade because I don't know what else I can say about it, other than the fact Rich... well, I'll go back to the question we always ask, do you think her dentist is somewhere in the back office treating patients, really proudly saying, my team member at the front desk is great. She's so nice, everybody loves her, she's doing a great job. I'm going to say yes, she thinks that.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: I think it's very possible that everybody loves her. There's no question about that. And then, I'm going to say yes also man, what would happen if the dentist were to walk in, some patient called, they're new in town, they needed a lot of treatment, they asked if we took CareCredit and I just hang up on them. I mean, geez, she should at least offer some other… say we do have other options available for you. Come in, let's talk. Let's meet the doctor. Let's do something here. It's hard to believe they don't have some kind of financial options even that option that we never recommend which is we do all this treatment and we hope that you pay by the month, you know, play and pray. Whatever, that's an option. I don't do that one but at least [crosstalk].
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Okay, I'm ready with my grade. My grade is an F, totally F. No question, final answer.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: I think that's a little harsh. I know now. Okay. Here's my grade. I'm going to hold it up for you watching on video. F, she totally failed. It's just a shame because she seemed really nice.  
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: I have nothing else to say.  
  
 Dr. Rich Madow: Episode 13, Season 2 of The Dental Practice Fixers. Thank you so much everybody for listening. I'm Dr. Richard Madow.
  
 Dr. Dave Madow: Dr. David Madow, we'll see you next time for sure.
  
 [Music]