June 2019 - The Dental Practice Fixers
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June 2019

Patients Only Want What Insurance Covers

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In today’s show, a doctor from the Midwest is struggling with his patients demanding that they only want what their insurance will cover. Is this common all over these days? How should this objection be handled? Tune in to find out what Dr. David Madow and Dr. Richard Madow have to say about this. Then of course we do the call of the week. We saw an ad in a local publication from a dental office who has quite the perio program! That sounds good but the way they describe it in the ad would take a combination MD, DDS, DMD and Mensa member to decode it. We call the office asking for an explanation. How do you think they did? Tune in to find out. If you have a question that you would like answered on our podcast, please send it in to podcast@madow.com. We will do our best to get yours answered!


Patients Only Want What Insurance Covers

 Dr. David Madow: Doctor, I only want what my insurance covers. If my insurance doesn't cover it, don't do it. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Oh. No. 
 Dr. David Madow: How many times have we heard something like this? I am Dr. David Madow along with... 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Dr. Richard Madow. Welcome to the Dental Practice Fixers podcast. We are so happy to have you with us today. Let's just get right down to a question from a listener. Here's what the question says. Yes, I'm reading it off of the email. 
 Dr. David Madow: Of course. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: If you want to email your question and by the way you can do it to: info@madow.com. Probably the easiest way to remember it, info@madow.com. Maybe next week, we'll be reading your questions. So this is from Dr. Jay Hawkman in Ohio. He didn't say what city. I guess it's just somewhere in Ohio. Okay and he says. 'Guys, I have what you might call a typical practice in the Midwest. Lots of good folks, middle-income, most have insurance, you get the picture.' You get the picture? 
 Dr. David Madow: Kind of. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I totally get the picture. Sounds like a nice place to be. 
 Dr. David Madow: Yeah, yeah. I like it already. 2 | P a g e 1-800-258-0060 info@madow.com 
  
 Dr. Richard Madow: And so do I. 'Something that really frustrates me is when patients say, I only want what my insurance covers, or Sounds good doc, but if my insurance doesn't pay for it, I can't get it done. What can I do about this? Dr. Jay Hawkman somewhere in Ohio. It's another Madow trick. Those of you who are maybe contemplating going on the dental speaking circuit, if you ever speak in the state of Ohio, when you get up to the microphone, the first thing you say is... 
 Dr. David Madow: O-H- 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I-O. Well they respond I-O. I don't maybe there are cities where they don't like Ohio state. Maybe the University of Ohio, I can't remember where that is but I guess they don't maybe like Ohio State that much. I don't know. 
 Dr. David Madow: But I think if you're in the Columbus area, it’s pretty safe. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Maybe if you're in Ann Arbor Michigan, definitely do not do that. That's just a suggestion. 
 Dr. David Madow: Just a suggestion. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: So okay. So Dr. Hawkman, great question. What do you think? 
 Dr. David Madow: Yeah. I see it on two levels actually. Let's face it. This is rampant in all dental practices across North America, at least the US. I see it on two levels. Number one, patient education. Patient needs to be educated on what's going on and why it's important to have done it and why you just can't like pick and choose and do things that only your insurance covers. So that's number one. And number two is, have ways available for the patient to pay that amount for the amount that the insurance doesn’t cover. I guarantee if that patient wanted a 60-inch big-screen TV, there's a way to finance that. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: For the big game? 
 Dr. David Madow: For the big game. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: We're not allowed to say Super Bowl. 
 Dr. David Madow: Don't say Super Bowl. 3 | P a g e 1-800-258-0060 info@madow.com 
  
 Dr. Richard Madow: It's copyrighted. We always say the big game. 
 Dr. David Madow: Or we get sued. We're getting sued [crosstalk]. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I think that's probably before the... 
 Dr. David Madow: Stanley Cup is an old friend of mine. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Okay. You know Stanley Cup. 
 Dr. David Madow: So like I said, if that person wanted a new car or a 60 inch TV, they're going to find a way to finance it. They're not going to say, I only want what my insurance covers. They're not going to do that because insurance isn't covering that. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Yeah, but on the other hand if they want a new car, they might like want a really expensive car, they might want a Mercedes but say, well, I can't afford that, so I'm going to get whatever, a nice Hyundai Elantra. So it's not like the sky's the limit here. Right? 
 Dr. David Madow: Yeah. But if you look around and most people driving cars, most people are driving cars that can't afford the [crosstalk]. They are just making payments. Making payments. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Just make payments doc. 
 Dr. David Madow: That's right. Exactly. We got to make sure. We have to check that out. So two things, Education and financing somehow. Working out payments; some type of payment. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Well, I would comment on both things you said. And then throw in something else. I agree with education to a certain extent, but I think and this is actually something we're going to touch upon in our call of the week this week. I think sometimes when doctors or assistants or hygienists or whoever, you know, treatment coordinators try to educate, they give too much information, they over talk, they over explain and they scare the patient away and then they're worse off than they were before if the patient has just gotten what insurance covered. So you got to be really careful when you're trying to so-called "educate" the patient. What you really trying to do is move them towards treatment and we can talk about that maybe, I don't know maybe now or another episode. 4 | P a g e 1-800-258-0060 info@madow.com 
  
 Secondly, I totally agree, have financing available. We love CareCredit as you know and present it that way; say you know we can do this and the payments will be $120 a month or whatever it is. It just makes it much easier to understand and to take but I'm going to take maybe a slightly different tack. You know as some people say, present what you have to present, some will, some won't, who's next? And I think if you have a practice let's say a typical practice, I don't know. Dr. Hawkman, how many patients do you have? Active patients. 1200, 1500, 2000, something like that. A certain percentage, probably way more than half are just going to be insurance driven patients and you can explain, you can over explain, you can man explain, you can, as some people say, talk till the cows come home, and they're just not going to be interested. And a certain percentage would want the best you have to offer. And I think maybe in some ways, I hate to use the term profile; maybe we have to profile our patients and say, who's who and say, look, if you know 65% of my patients are just insurance patients, they go through the insurance treadmill, they want only what insurance covers but they still come in every six months and we love them. Well, maybe we should just accept those patients. I'm not saying not offer them the best, but don't drive yourself crazy, don't tear your hair out with these kinds of questions. And then the patients maybe who want a more advanced level of dentistry and are willing to pay for it, that's fantastic. Let's give them what they want, too. 
 Dr. David Madow: Well yeah, I agree. You don't have to tear your hair out. You don't have to say let's either you get everything done or you go to another practice, but I still think it's worth a great effort to make sure they understand why they need this, why it's important to get it done and we have financing options. And explaining to them that insurance is not meant to cover all dental care, but it's meant to be an adjunct to help them out and you're really fortunate that you have it, but it's not going to cover everything and these are really important things you got to get done or your mouth is going to be infected and rotting away. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Totally agree. I completely agree with that. I think maybe the path that I'm worried about is and we saw this in a practice that we were working with several years ago where I can’t remember if it was a dentist or a team member was kind of almost getting into a little debate with the patient and all these things are true what they were saying like well the insurance company didn't examine your mouth, the insurance company doesn't care about you. All they care about is 5 | P a g e 1-800-258-0060 info@madow.com 
  
 their bottom line. And I think when you start going down that road, you're getting combative and it really turns the patient off. 
 Dr. David Madow: It doesn't mean anything. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: But I think what you just said is a nicer way of saying that insurance isn't meant to cover everything; it’s an adjunct that helps you pay for this treatment that you do need. 
 Dr. David Madow: And you're very fortunate that you have it. A lot of people don't even have it. They've got to pay everything out of pocket. You've got this great help here. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I remember when I was a young practitioner, I had a patient who had pretty crappy insurance and they were asking me questions like why doesn't my insurance cover this? Do I really need it? I made the mistake. I said to him, look, I got to be honest with you. You have really lousy insurance and the second I said it, I thought, shit. I should not have said that. And the patient kind of took it personally. It was a really, really bad thing to say. 
 Dr. David Madow: Did he come back? 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I don't remember if he came back as a regular patient, but I remember, he did not get the treatment done that I was trying to get him to do. That insurance wouldn't cover. So I think it's always important to stay positive. Don't get into a fight with a patient. Don't tell them they have crappy insurance even if they do, they'll probably know by the end of your conversation anyway. So yeah, I mean a lot of good points but I think one point is realize that... 
 Dr. David Madow: How about if you just say your insurance is, it's not crappy but it's kind of low-end. Most insurances pay more than yours. It's kind of like a low-end insurance. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Your insurance is pretty good. It's pretty bad. It's mediocre. Lot of words for that. 
 Dr. David Madow: So so. On a scale from like mild to hot. It's like probably around a 2. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Mild to hot...Like it’s a Thai restaurant? It's not Thai spicy, that's for sure. 6 | P a g e 1-800-258-0060 info@madow.com 
  
 Dr. David Madow: You know by the way, a quick aside, I was in a Thai restaurant like a month or so ago. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Months? I thought you go more like once a week. 
 Dr. David Madow: Well, I was at one a few days ago too but this is the particular one I want to tell you about just real quickly about. So I think they said, well, how spicy do you want it? I said, well, what can we do? How spicy? She said, well, we can do, what'd she say. She said five is the hottest. So in other words she said, you want a five. I think she said, do you want a five? And meanwhile without like a scale there, [crosstalk]. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Could be 5 out of 100. 
 Dr. David Madow: That's what it was. She was like, I would do a 5. But I don't know what 5 on the scale is. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Probably you would have asked. It never hurts to ask. Did you ask? 
 Dr. David Madow: Well, it never hurts to ask. I just said give it to me as hot as you can. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Well, you know it's funny because I was in a Thai restaurant one time where they told me it was spicy on a scale of 1 to 10. And I said I want an 11. And not only did I not want an 11 but she totally didn't get the Spinal Tap reference joke which... 
 Dr. David Madow: There's no way she'll get that. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I guess in retrospect I really shouldn't have expected... 
 Dr. David Madow: And then if she did, you would have been screwed like the plate would have been on fire. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: On fire. They were brought out in flames. So yeah, maybe not a good idea to rate your patient’s insurance. So maybe not. But I do think in general, also in dental practice, in life maybe, I'm not saying you shouldn't have high expectations but it's also good to understand that the best is not for everyone and then if you have a good patient that comes in every six months 7 | P a g e 1-800-258-0060 info@madow.com 
  
 and maybe they've made some referrals and maybe they're more insurance driven than you would prefer, they can still be a good patient. So don't get all, as some people would say, all frustrated. 
 Dr. David Madow: There are a lot of references in this episode. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I know. Don't get all frustrated. Why do some people leave the first “r” out of frustrated? I've heard that, it's like a Midatlantic or Baltimore thing. 
 Dr. David Madow: I think it is. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I just get very frustrated. 
 Dr. David Madow: We'd like to hear from some of our California people if anybody there says frustrated. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I doubt they do in California. They don't probably even use that word. Nobody is frustrated in California. [Crosstalk]. 
 Dr. David Madow: They're probably all frustrated. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: They all love it there. 
 Dr. David Madow: Should we do the call? I mean I think we've said everything we have to say about this. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Not only do we have a really interesting call, we have a guest caller. 
 Dr. David Madow: We have a guest caller today. Who's going to be doing the call today? 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Well I recruited Hope from the Madow Center For Dental Practice Success to do this call and she was great and we'll explain that in a second. Before we do that, I just want to let you know really quickly. It seems like November is a long way away but TBSE is coming up fast; we fully expect to sell out this year. It's back in Las Vegas at the Tropicana resort hotel, incredible. I actually just had a little email exchange yesterday with one of our speakers Dr. Steve Rasner. You probably know or heard of Steve Rasner. He's the guy with the $4 million practice in one of the worst economically challenged cities in the country, Bridgeton, New Jersey, high poverty levels, high unemployment, just not a place where you'd want to practice, yet he amazingly 8 | P a g e 1-800-258-0060 info@madow.com 
  
 not only has a $4 million practice, he loves going in everyday and he has patients, speaking of the opposite of these insurance driven patients, his patients are getting comprehensive care, saying yes to full treatment plans, putting down the deposit on the first day and saying, doc, I want to do the whole shebang or the whole nine yards. 
 Dr. David Madow: I'm going to hear about that. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: So he's going to explain. 
 Dr. David Madow: He's going to be teaching the whole thing. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: From A to Z, including something you need to say on the phone when a new patient calls before their first visit that nobody else is doing that makes a huge difference. He is going to be explaining this whole system from A to Z at TBSE and that's only one of the fantastic speakers. So check out the whole speaker lineup: TBSE.com, sign up soon before it sells out and before the tuition goes up; we're still doing a little “early birdish” stuff. So we'll see you in Vegas at TBSE in November. 
 Dr. David Madow: I'll tell you something, I'm going to go. Sounds great. [Crosstalk]. While we're at it, you know Rich and I love what we do. We are doing this podcast for you. We don't charge for the podcast. You don't have to pay us any money. We would never turn it down but people charge for all kinds of information. On our show here we're actually not only giving you great information but showing you a way that every time you listen, you can have money in your pocket. All you have to do is go to our people, Fattmerchant, change your credit card processing company and you will save a lot of money every single month hardly doing anything, with hardly making any change at all. All you have to do is go to bit.ly/fattmad. Let them know that you know us. We use their company. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: We love their company. 
 Dr. David Madow: Because we save a ton of money every single month. You will do the same thing. Why would you want to turn down $100, $200, $1,000 extra every month? Whatever it might be depending on the volume of your practice, why would you ever want to turn it down? It's 9 | P a g e 1-800-258-0060 info@madow.com 
  
 free money for you. Take advantage now. bit.ly/fattmad. And if they use that link, they get a free terminal. Well, it couldn’t be better. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Just like at the airport, there's a free terminal. 
 Dr. David Madow: There's no outlay of any money in any way I believe. 
 Dr. Ricahrd Madow: Got to do it. So okay so I came into the office this morning and Hope Miller who a lot of you probably know, she's one of our great team members here shows me this ad in a local magazine for a dental practice. And she said, what do you think of this ad? I'm looking at the ad and of course you and I tear apart all ads that we see, but it had this one paragraph that was so scientific and wanted to so much in detail. I said, like, what the heck? I didn't know... 
 Dr. David Madow: Did you understand it? 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Not really. I mean I got the gist of it. 
 Dr. David Madow: And we're dentits. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: But I didn't know the references they were making. I said, Hope, let's do a call. She said, are you going to call that office? Hope, you call. So she did. She pretty much just read the ad back to them. 
 Dr. David Madow: Should we play it? 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Let's hear. Let's do the call. 
 Hope: Hi, good morning. I'm calling because I saw your ad in the Jewish times and I was reading your ad and I have a question. It says here that you all provide periodontal therapy with an emphasis on reducing systemic inflammation and infection to support optimal cognitive development and cardiovascular Bale-Doneen health. What the heck does that mean? I don't even understand that. 
 Female: So what Bale-Doneen means is if you look that up it's very complicated but they are two cardiologists, one named Bale and the other one is Doneen. They have basically finally in 2019 are admitting and are recognizing that the pathogens in the bacteria in the mouth are leading to not 10 | P a g e 1-800-258-0060 info@madow.com 
  
 only heart disease and diabetes, but also to Alzheimer’s. And so we are working with a cardiologist here in Maryland who is actually referring patients to us who have had heart disease of some form, maybe they had a heart attack or a stroke or they are having heart problems and they're referring them to us to do their dental treatment and to remove the bacteria to a sense that we do this test. We've always tested the bacteria but now we're actually going deeper with our cardiac patients and we're testing through an actual site that will send the test to and then they’ll test it to see what are the chances are the person is going to have a heart attack. 
 Hope: Oh my gosh, thanks so much. I'm more confused than ever but I really appreciate your explaining everything. 
 Female: But if you google Bale-Doneen method, you will be probably overwhelmed with information that's so interesting. We are so deep into it. Every month we have a two-hour meeting and we talk about all the new information that we're learning. It's new to us too. We've only been on the path for maybe the last six months. So, every month we learn new stuff. It's just it's so much to learn. We're actually all reading the book, but it's, we've known for years that the bacteria in the mouth are causing people to not only have heart attacks and heart disease but to die. And but we just couldn't seem to get cardiologists on the same, you know path and now they are. Now they're starting to be like, okay, maybe my patient needs to go to the dentist. So, we're like one of the only dentists that are on this journey. 
 Hope: Wow, you are doing great work. I want to thank you so much. I really appreciate your explaining everything to me. 
 Female: You're welcome. All right, take care. 
 Hope: Bye-bye. 
 Female: Bye-bye. 
 Dr. David Madow: Whoo. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Wake up, wake up. 
 Dr. David Madow: That was great. 11 | P a g e 1-800-258-0060 info@madow.com 
  
 Dr. Richard Madow: Talk about over explaining. Yeah, I love how she said like it's very complicated and if you google this will be overwhelming. Okay, great. Wow. She was knowledgeable. 
 Dr. David Madow: She was very knowledgeable. I mean I think it's great what they're doing. In general, it's great what they're doing but to have an ad like that in a local paper and with all those words, you could do it so much differently and have a better effect. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I totally agree. I think she was also going into dangerous territory there a little bit and this is just maybe splitting hairs but saying that it's been shown that the bacteria in the mouth can cause heart attacks. I think may be linked to heart attacks and stroke is one thing, but causing heart attacks, Wow. But again, I mean I know she was doing her best to explain. 
 Dr. David Madow: I got a little bit scared. I started thinking, I'd better have the bacteria in my mouth checked out. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Started getting chest pains. 
 Dr. David Madow: I started a little bit. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: My jaw hurts a little bit on the left side. You know I think the double critique will be this and remember when Hope read the ad, no lay person is going to read this ad and say, oh my god, I know exactly what this means. I want to go in this office. And then I don't think she made things any better when Hope called. 
 Dr. David Madow: Right, right. I mean look we could talk about this probably for twenty minutes but it was way too complex. Again, I think what they're doing is a great service. They're paying more attention to periodontal needs than most dentists are, it's great, but explain it in lay terms. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Okay. So for example, it’s been shown now that inflammation in your gums or even low-level forms of gum disease can be linked to heart attacks and strokes and we're paying extra careful attention to that and that's why Hopkins cardiologists are actually referring their patients to us. Boom. 
 Dr. David Madow: That would actually get me in there. 12 | P a g e 1-800-258-0060 info@madow.com 
  
 Dr. Richard Madow: Speaking of getting you in there. 
 Dr. David Madow: Oh yeah, exactly. She went through this... I don't know how long the call was three to four minutes it seemed like and at the very end when Hope says, thank you so much, you were really helpful. She said, okay, bye. I mean she took all that time to explain it and she never even once said, can we set up an appointment? Does this resonate with you? Is there anybody in your family that has heart disease or are you concerned? Anything like that, nothing. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Now as we always say, not only does the doctor have no idea that happened but they're paying big bucks for this full-page ad. They're paying a lot of shekels for that ad in the Jewish times and then somebody calls amazingly, actually calls referencing the ad. 
 Dr. David Madow: We would probably be the only one. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: No question about it. And then she does this long explanation and the patient has vanished, never asked like a name. 
 Dr. David Madow: Probably she went up to the doctor, doctor, we got a call from the ad. We got one. He says, and how did it go. Well, I didn't really ask for the appointment. What do you mean you didn't ask for the appointment? 
 Dr. Richard Madow: You got their name and we'll call them back, right? 
 Dr. David Madow: I didn't get any information. Let me look at caller ID to see if it showed up there. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Caller ID just shows Skype. It was Mr. Skype. Wow. 
 Dr. David Madow: So if we have to grade, I mean I've got to give an F because she got no information. First of all she was talking way too complex and then she didn't get any information. It has to be an F, there's no other grade. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Could it be a double F? 
 Dr. David Madow: It could be. 13 | P a g e 1-800-258-0060 info@madow.com 
  
 Dr. Richard Madow: Okay, I'm going to do a double F. Alright everyone, that is your latest episode of the Dental Practice Fixers. Thanks so much for listening, thanks so much for watching. I'm Dr. Richard Madow. 
 Dr. David Madow: Dr. David Madow. Keep those cards and letters and questions coming. We'll see you next time. Thanks for being with us. 
 [Music Playing] 

Large Tattoos on Team Members – Do You Hire Them?

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A doctor writes in asking how The Dental Practice Fixers feel about hiring team members with large visible tattoos. He has been doing a lot of interviewing and says that this is extremely common these days. His concern is that they do not look good and he is worried that his patients, especially the elderly ones, will go elsewhere. Tune in to find out what Dr. David Madow and Dr. Richard Madow have to say about this. Then of course we do the call of the week. We call an office asking a fairly simple question – Are you accepting new patients? It’s the call that every dental office would LOVE. How do you think they did? You need to listen to this one. If you have a question that you would like answered on our podcast, please send it in to podcast@madow.com. We will do our best to get yours answered!


Large Tattoos on Team Members – Do You Hire Them?

 Dr.  Richard Madow:  Hiring new team members has always been a bit of a tricky proposition, but it  seems like these days there’s a new complication that’s been thrown into the  mix. We’re going to hear about that on our question in this week’s episode of  the Dental Practice Fixers Podcast. Welcome, welcome, welcome everyone. I am  Dr. Richard Madow, along here with my cohort and co-host. 
  Dr.  David Madow: Dr.  David Madow. How are you all doing? Welcome back, we really appreciate you and  let’s get right into the question today. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Let’s do it. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  It’s a great one. I’m surprised we haven’t got this question earlier.  
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  I know. I think we’ve got it in our live seminars before. Yeah, I think so. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Have we got it? Oh okay. Anyway, this is something that is probably going to  affect if it hasn’t yet, every single dental practice out there. It starts out  with Rich and Dave, hey guys, love the podcast. Thank you so much, we  appreciate that. I’ve been a practicing dentist for over 35 years and still  love every single day in the office. There are no plans to retire. Well I’m  not sure that’s great because you should have some kind of exit strategy at  some point. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow: Well  it doesn’t mean he can’t afford to retire. It’s just means he has no plans to  retire. That’s great. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Like most dentists, we have staff members who leave for various reasons. So,  every now and then we need to hire someone new. The last few times I’ve  interviewed people, they all had very large visible tattoos which I found to  be unattractive. I know these things are commonplace these days, but many of  my patients are older and I don’t think they would appreciate team members  with tattoos, piercings, etc. What do I do? Dr. Abner Smith from Georgia. That  explains the whole thing. But actually, it doesn’t because tattoos are  ubiquitous. No matter what state… 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  State, city, urban, rural. I mean they’re just – they’re everywhere. Tattoos  are extremely… 
  Dr.  David Madow: Hey  have you ever seen mine?  
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  I don’t want to. Hold on… 
  Dr.  David Madow: It  says Marshall. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Is this Marshall? What? 
  Dr.  David Madow:  This is Marshall. I had one that said Barb but I took – I covered it with  Marshall. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  As you remember many years ago, I think it was Marshall – Marshall’s our  middle brother. It was he’s 50th birthday so he’s 61 now.  
  Dr.  David Madow:  Wait a minute… 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  So it’s 11 years ago. 
  Dr.  David Madow: It  was 11 years ago. Are you sure it’s that long ago? 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  The three cool brothers were in Atlantic City. Well it’s not the three cool  brothers, it’s just us – for Marshall’s 50th birthday and I think  we should all get like some kind of brothers tattoo. If everybody agrees on  them and you said you’re in. Right? 
  Dr.  David Madow: I  was in. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Then Marshall wouldn’t do it. You know what? Thank you, Marshall, I’m glad you  didn’t say do it. 
  Dr.  David Madow: I  think we should have done it. I think Marshall should have done it. Even a  small – little small thing – who would care? 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  When we were kids, I think – and again, I don’t know, maybe we had a sheltered  upbringing. Only men with like a tough upbringing like the merchant marines or  whatever would have tattoos. 
  Dr.  David Madow: Do  you remember our barber’s name when we were kids?  
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Rudy? 
  Dr.  David Madow: No,  way before Rudy. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Rudy was in jail. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Yeah way before, but you might have been too young to remember. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  I don’t remember. 
  Dr.  David Madow: We  went to a place called Pete and Sam. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow: I  remember Pete and Sam. Sure. 
  Dr.  David Madow: Do  you remember that? You just said, I think they might have been in the merchant  marines.  
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Merchant marines. Right. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  They had tattoos. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  So, when we were really little kids, early to mid-60s, those were typically  the kind of people and then it became much more common for men to have  tattoos. Any kind of job, education level or whatever. And now, obviously, it  seems like more women, more young women have tattoos than men. So, they’re  very typical, they’re very normal. They don’t mean anything other than the  fact that you’ve got the tattoo. I mean that’s all it means. So, I think if  you’re going to say, I don’t want to hire people with tattoos, well you’re  going to be cutting yourself out of a huge percentage and probably some very  talented and smart people or you’re going to be discriminating against it so  to speak. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Many young people. Maybe even the majority.  
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  But what do you think? Do you think that if this person truly is in an area  where his patient population is maybe older and really conservative that he  should be cautious about hiring people with visible tattoos? 
  Dr.  David Madow: So,  you said visible tattoos. So, in other words, let’s say if somebody comes in  to the interview, let’s say a woman comes in to the interview and let’s say  she has tattoos but you can’t see them. They’re not visible. They’re on her  back or wherever they may be. They’re not visible during the interview. Does  anything need to be said at all like I just want to make sure if you have  tattoos whenever you’d come in, they’re covered up or if you can’t see them  during the interview, do you assume they will never be seen during work time? 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  That is a really good question. In other words, I guess the basic question  here is do we have an office policy, no visible tattoos. 
  Dr.  David Madow: I  think that’s a possibility. But suppose – where do you draw the line? Suppose  a team member has a little tiny tattoo that he can’t hide but it’s not getting  in anybody’s way and it’s not in bad taste or anything. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  I was going to say I’ve seen young ladies with tattoos on kind of the inside  of their wrist. Right here, a cute little design. Nobody I think would say  it’s horrible. They look nice. That’s a visible tattoo. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Yes. So, what’s the rule? Where do you draw the line? So, what we’re talking  about is if somebody comes in and they are no visible tattoos but you still  have like an office policy in place that says – that it clearly states no  visible tattoos during patient treatment time or something like that. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Oh I see what you’re saying. So like after hours, you don’t care what they do.  They can walk around with very short sleeve shirts… 
  Dr.  David Madow: I  think you can’t tell somebody what to do after hours… 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Of course not.  
  Dr.  David Madow: I  think you can’t tell them that. But is it out of line? I guess it’s legal or  with HR – will the HR police get after you if you have it in your booklet that  says no visible tattoos allowed during clinical patient time. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  When I finished my residency and again, times were different. This was 1985.  I’m sure you remember one of my very early associateships was in a suburb of  Baltimore called Dundalk. Now Dundalk is the classic… 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Tattoo palace. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow: Right.  Stereotype blue color town, tattoos everywhere and we had this dental  assistant and I don’t think she had tattoos. But she wore like this weird  makeup. She had all these different colors on her eyes and she had one of  those haircuts where it was shaved on one side and slicked over on the other… 
  Dr.  David Madow: In  the 80s? 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  80s. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  That was a little weird. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  She was really radical. And I’m thinking, what the F? This is a dental office.  Who’s going to come in and let this woman treat them? So, the flipside of that  is, of course, she was a great person, fantastic with patients, excellent  clinical assistant. I forgot about it like working with her for a day or two.  I didn’t even look at her and see this kind of freaky persona. I just saw this  great person who was a fantastic dental assistant and I think people were much  more closed minded in those days. I’ve got another story I want to share, but  I think on this question, my answer is to loosen up, tattoos are normal.  Obviously, you don’t want somebody with a teardrop tattoo come out of their  eye which means they’re in a gang or murdered someone. 
  Dr.  David Madow: Is  that what it means? 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  I think so. 
  Dr.  David Madow: I  don’t even know that. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Or like profanity or something like that. But I think using the word tasteful  is tough because that’s objective, subjective. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Subjective. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Thank you. That’s a subjective term. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Right. You can’t say that only tasteful tattoos are allowed. Well who decides? 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  I think it’s time, it’s 2019. If you’re listening to this, it’s current. I  think it’s time to let it go and just hire people who are – present well, have  great clinical skills, are good with patients and not worry about it. What do  you think? 
  Dr.  David Madow: So  you’re saying that – I think you need to have some type of guidelines in place  because by what you’re saying, it will be totally fine especially on a warm  day when your assistant is wearing something sleeveless… 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Well they can after work clinical attire. They can’t wear… 
  Dr.  David Madow: They  have like the whole arm – what do you call it? a sleeve. A whole arm tattooed  up and maybe the neck. Is that okay? For professional practice. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  I think it’s fine. It’s funny, I think that there are certain rules that we  have to have with our team members. And one is they have to present well. It  means they can’t come in poorly dressed. Clothes that don’t look right in a  clinical – it doesn’t mean you have to spend a lot of money. But it means your  clothes have to be clean and they have to look great in a clinical setting.  And your hair is to be pull back properly and you can’t have long dangling  earrings. These things get in the way of proper treatment. But I think when it  comes to somebody’s looks which includes tattoos, I don’t know. I wouldn’t mind  if a woman has a sleeve tattoo working in my practice if she’s a great  assistant and dresses normally. 
  Dr.  David Madow: I  think it depends on the area. Like you said, Dundalk, Maryland it will  totally… 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  I think you call it tattoo palace.  
  Dr.  David Madow:  It’s not like a knock on Dundalk but like Upper West Side of Manhattan, a  practice there. If somebody was totally tattooed up, I don’t know if that’s so  cool.  
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Upper West Side Manhattan, I would say you’ve got a huge artistic community… 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Upper East side. Let’s go Upper East Side. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Upper East Side, that’s a little snootier.  
  Dr.  David Madow:  Going into a dental office and someone just – a person is just tattooed up, I  mean I personally have nothing against tattoos or I have nothing against them.  But again, I have nothing against a lot of things but a lot of things  shouldn’t be necessarily ok in a dental office.  
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  I guess I can only speak my personal opinion. I certainly wouldn’t mind being  treated by a dental assistant or a dentist or whatever that had sleeve tattoos  as long as they were great assistants or dentists. Will people leave your  practice? I don’t think so.  
  Dr.  David Madow: Let  me just give you an example. It’s been two or three years, I met a waitress in  Ruby Tuesday. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Again? You know waitresses.  
  Dr.  David Madow: I  met her. There was a waitress at Ruby Tuesday and she was super, super nice  and she was – let’s just say for a lack of a better term, I’m going to use –  she was all tattooed up. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  All tattooed up. ATU. 
  Dr.  David Madow: She  was ATU all the way and she told us a story that sometimes people would come  in like an elderly couple would come in and she would say hi I’m your waitress  today, and they would go to the manager and say, I do not want this woman  waiting on us with all this tattoos. So again, not everybody thinks the way we  think, and is it possible it’s hurting the practice having somebody that’s all  tattooed up working on patients. I think it could hurt the practice. I mean it  could. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  I guess the other side of that coin is sometimes you have to make a decision  like are you going to stand by your principles even if in some way it could be  detrimental to your practice. And back to this woman in that Dundalk practice,  sometimes she would come in with a big blue streak in her hair and some people  would say she’s a freakazoid, but she wasn’t. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Right. I think we’re going to have to leave this as it’s up to each practice  to decide but you should have something outlined in the office manual. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  I want to get back to the Ruby Tuesday for a second. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Yeah sure. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  And we’ve seen this many times. There are waitress, servers, waiters,  waitresses, whatever you want to call them. As a matter of fact one worked in  a restaurant near here. No tattoos, very clean appearance, but gingivitis.  That’s I think gross.  
  Dr.  David Madow:  Well you’ve got to say no gingivitis will… 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  But most restaurant owners don’t even know and now that is gross. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  They’ve got to have a soft tissue management program in the restaurant. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow: So  that’s disgusting. That person has got billions of disgusting infectious  bacteria in her mouth. That to me is much more important than tattoos or  piercings or something like that. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Yeah, I agree with you, but I’m thinking it goes without saying that you’re  not going to have somebody with gross periodontal disease working in the  dental practice. You’re just not going to allow that. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  I see people with bad teeth working in dental practices. You have too.  Sometimes it’s the dentist. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Absolutely. We have seen it. We definitely have seen it. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  I guess what I’m saying is I think if you’re worried about this, you’re  worried about the wrong thing. If there’s anything that could cause patients  to leave, I’ll bet there are patients who for one reason or another said, I  don’t want a male hygienist.  
  Dr.  David Madow: Oh  100%. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Well, you know, get with it.  
  Dr.  David Madow: So  we’ll just leave it with that. It’s subjective and it’s up to the practice. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  It’s a great question. 
  Dr.  David Madow: It  is a really good question. So, Dr. Smith, thanks so much for sending that.  Everybody, keep sending your great questions because we really appreciate you… 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  I would love to hear your opinion on this because I know that we have a really  – I know we would want to handle this question but I don’t know if we ever  really came to what we would say is a definitive answer for us.  
  Dr.  David Madow: No  it’s subjective. It depends on the office.  
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Please, if you’re listening to us, we’d love to hear you weigh in on this  topic. That will be great. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Yeah that would be fantastic. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  How do they reach us? Now I can’t remember. info@madow.com, you can’t go wrong  with that. info@ M A D O W.com 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Also, podcast@madow.com will get to us. But pretty much anything @madow.com.  You can send it to crazy@ -- no it won’t get to us. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  No don’t do that. rtrain@madow.com – it’s still info. Hey before we do our  call of the week. Who is coming to TBSE this year? Yes, November in Las Vegas  at the fantastic Tropicana Resort Hotel. We’ve got an incredible lineup of  speakers. It is the best bang for your buck in dental education. Nothing else  is even close. So, go to the website, check out the speakers, sign up while  the tuition is still really really low. It’s an incredible two days of not  just dental education, but fun, motivation, team building and a great  vacation. You certainly deserve a little vacation, especially when the  practice can pay for it. So that’s up to your accountant of course but I hope  you’re charging all your CE to the office. Go to tbse.com. The Best Seminar  Ever. Tbse.com. Look at the speaker line up, it will absolutely appeal to you  and bring the team. We’ll be there, we’ll be hanging out, we’ll be shooting  the breeze, having a good all time with you in Vegas. So again, tbse.com and  we’ll see you there. 
  Dr.  David Madow: 25th  anniversary. We’ve been here for 25 years. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Yeah 25 years. Cheers. 
  Dr.  David Madow: How  have we been doing this for 25 years?  
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Unbelievable. I’m not so sure. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  It’s going to be special though. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  It’s kind of like a disease. We can’t get rid of it. It comes back year after  year after year.  
  Dr.  David Madow:  It’s going to be very special. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Special. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Before we move on to the call Rich, let’s talk about something. I know we  mention this every single episode for a reason. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Is there a reason? 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Because if somebody just said to me, how would you like to have a check or how  would you like to save a lot of money every single month. I’d be stupid enough  not to listen especially if it were so simple that everybody could do it. Well  that’s why we talk about Fattmerchant. The credit card processing company that  we truly believe in. We use them here at the Madow Center, we switched to that  – how long – about a year ago?  
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  About a year ago. Maybe a year and a half ago. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Something like that, but we’ve never been happier. Transactions are smoother.  Everything goes well, plus we’ve saved so much money and you can do the same  thing in your dental practice. When you sign up with Fattmerchant, it’s simple  to switch. They do everything for you including if you use our special link  that we’re going to give you. They’ll give you the free terminal. Free  terminal, you don’t have to do anything and you’ll start saving a lot of money  every single month. If you’re not doing this, you’re kind of nuts not to do  it. Why wouldn’t you want to do this, go to bit.ly/fattmad which is F A T T M  A D, if you’re watching on video we’re putting a little thing down there so  you can make sure you have the spelling right. But however you get there, if  you’re not doing this, you'll be losing out on money every single month, why  wouldn’t you do it.  
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  All right, let’s do the call of the week.  
  Voice Recording: For quality of  service, this call may be recorded. 
  [phone ringing] 
  Female  Speaker:  Good morning, thank you for calling. How may I help you? 
  Dr.  David Madow: Hi,  my wife asked me to make this call. She kind of put it on my to-do list today.  She wanted me to ask you if you’re accepting new patients. 
  Female  Speaker:  Yes, we are.  
  Dr.  David Madow: Okay  great. I’ll let her know. Thank you very much. 
  Female  Speaker: No  problem, bye, bye. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Okay, bye.  
  Dr.  Richard Madow: Do  you ever just want to like raise your hand and scream. Is anybody listening?  
  Dr. David Madow: I don’t get it. I really don’t get  it Rich. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  The simplest of all calls; two patients because I would assume the husband and  wife are coming in. Right? 
  Dr.  David Madow: I  was just going to say the same thing. Almost guaranteed two patients. She  answers the question, yeah we’re accepting new patients but she didn’t take it  any further. And you know something that I think might have been one of the  problems. Okay so did you hear as soon as I started the question, another  phone was ringing in the background. I think what was on her – on her mind was  I’ve got to get to that other call. And it rang twice and I said okay thank  you very much. It was much easier for her to say no problem and take the other  call than to start explaining. And then the other call keeps coming in and  that’s what I thought. I felt it. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  It’s a really good point. I think when there’s another call coming in whether  it’s even in your personal life, when you got that annoying call waiting thing  or your whole focus shifts. Who’s this new caller? Is this more important than  the call you’re on? Do I need to put Mom on hold? You’re right, you’re so  right. So first of all, nobody should be in that position in the dental  practice. You should have enough people to answer the phone and even if  there’s a clinical team member who is not busy that second, they should be –  they should have the mindset that they’re going to grab that phone if it’s  ringing. So really good point.  
  Dr.  David Madow: So  I wonder if they had proper staffing there and somebody else took that other  call that was obviously ringing in the background, if she would have more time  to devote with me, if she would have been better she would have… 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  My guess is no. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Maybe not but at least she would have a chance. But now all she’s thinking is  I need to pick up that second call. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  So in that scenario, she could have said excuse me for one second. I’ll just  put you on a very brief hold. 
  Dr.  David Madow: Yes  exactly. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Boom and then just handle that call even if it means getting some information  and calling someone back or putting them on a brief hold. She’s got a live  wire right here that wants to know if you’re accepting new patients.  
  Dr.  David Madow: My  wife said – made it a point to send me to call… 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  And I’ll do whatever my wife said. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Exactly. Your wife asks you to call, there’s a reason you’re doing this.  You’re trying to find a dentist who’s taking new patients. Are you the one or  not?  
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Well we’re accepting new patients, we’re just not appointing them.  
  Dr.  David Madow:  That’s exactly right. So here’s the thing Rich. I guess every single time, the  doctor who’s obviously doing great clinical work is thinking… 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Obviously, well not so obviously but… 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Thinking that oh my front desk person, my scheduling assistant or… 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  June is fantastic. 
  Dr.  David Madow: She  is great, she is so nice and she’s taking care of answering questions. Does he  have any idea this is going on? 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Clueless. 
  Dr.  David Madow: No  idea. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  No idea. 
  Dr.  David Madow: And  we say this every time for a reason because I know there are probably doctors  who are listening or watching right now and saying, well this would never  happen in my practice. Well guess what, it probably is.  
  Dr.  Richard Madow: Send  us your number. We’ll find out. Send us your number.  
  Dr.  David Madow:  Grade? 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  I hate to keep failing people but I think it’s going to have to be an F. 
  Dr.  David Madow: We  got to fail her. F  
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Yeah she’s a failure. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Because she didn’t ask for anything. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  She did nothing. Thanks for nothing. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Thanks for nothing. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  She did nothing. Alright. 
  Dr.  David Madow: I  think that wraps it up. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Next I’m telling you, next episode it’s not going to be an F. They got to be  at least a B plus. 
  Dr.  David Madow: I  really hope – I want that. We really want that. We want to prove that some  people are fantastic. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  We want everyone to pass. 
  Dr.  David Madow:  Until next time, Dr. David Madow. 
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Dr. Richard Madow. Thanks for listening and watching. We’ll see you soon. 
  [music playing] 
  
   

Doctor Runs Late – Is This Destroying My Practice?

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Here is a practice where the doctor is always running late simply because he just loves to chat it up with his patients. A team member is bringing this up because she is extremely frustrated. We find that running late is a very common occurrence in dental practices all across the USA. So the question is how does it affect patient retention and the office’s bottom line? Tune in to find out what Dr. David Madow and Dr. Richard Madow have to say about this. Then of course we do the call of the week. We call an office asking a great question – I would like to come in as a new patient but does the doctor run on time? How do you think they did? You need to listen to this one. If you have a question that you would like answered on our podcast, please send it in to podcast@madow.com. We will do our best to get yours answered!


Doctor Runs Late – Is This Destroying My Practice?

Dr. David Madow: Is the doctor constantly running late destroying your practice? Stay tuned, we’re going to find out right now. Welcome back to the Dental Practice Fixers Podcast. I am Dr. David Madow, along with… 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I’m Dr. Richard Madow. We are your co-hosts for the Dental Practice Fixers Podcast. Thanks so much everybody for listening, for watching, for sending us your comments. Why don’t we get right down to it because we have a really cool question today. Here’s the question, I’ll just read it. It says Doctors Madow. I really like that… 
 Dr. David Madow: The Doctors Madow. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Doctors Madow. Yeah, I have friends who are physicians and they’re both – they insist on being called the doctors. 
 Dr. David Madow: The doctors. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I’m not going to say their last name just in case they’re listening. But they don’t know… 
 Dr. David Madow: Guess what, they’re not listening. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Let’s just say it’s Smith. They have to be introduced as the Doctors Smith. 
 Dr. David Madow: It’s not a true story. It’s not true. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: It’s true. Like if you send them an invitation to a wedding or something…  
 Dr. David Madow: The Doctors Smith. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: The Doctors Smith. 
 Dr. David Madow: How about the Doctors Smiths? It’s not that? 
 Dr. Richard Madow: It’s kind of like saying I have two brother in-laws, where it actually should be two brothers in-law. Right? 
 Dr. David Madow: Yeah exactly. But I’ve got two brothers in-law. I got two brother in-laws. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Do you? 
 Dr. David Madow: I don’t think I have any brothers in-law. 
 Dr. Ricard Madow: Sure you do. 
 Dr. David Madow: Who’s my brother in law? 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Yoko’s brother. 
 Dr. David Madow: Oh he’s my brother in-law. Right. I didn’t think about that there for a second. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I have a whole slew of them because Kandace has a large family. So I’ve got brothers in-law, sisters in-law coming out the ying-yang 
 Dr. David Madow: And you have a lot of brother in-laws too. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Exactly. 
 Dr. David Madow: Let’s read the question. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: No mother in-laws unfortunately. Okay. Doctors Madow, I work for a fantastic dentist. He does great work and he’s kind to all of his patients. He really cares and this can cause him to talk a bit too much. You know where that’s going. Right? I feel that we’re constantly running late. I can tell our patients don’t like it when we get them from the waiting room 20 or 30 minutes after their appointment time. Is there anything that can be done about this? And this is from Aubrey in Dothan, Alabama.  
 
 Dr. David Madow: Dothan. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Dothan, Alabama. 
 Dr. David Madow: We spoke there. Remember we… 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Do you remember we spoke there? It was a great seminar… 
 Dr. David Madow: Was that the one that was like almost an arena? It was great. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Yes it was. It was like a miniature arena. I felt like… 
 Dr. David Madow: Yeah. Like a miniature hockey arena. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Exactly. But the way it was laid out, I felt like we were the Beatles in 1963. 
 Dr. David Madow: Let me tell you… 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Coming to our first US gig and it was a really cool arena. It was fun. I can’t say that the stands were all packed. Pretty much… 
 Dr. David Madow: Well I could say that even though they weren’t. Because the stands weren’t all packed already. Weren’t they selling popcorn and hotdogs and stuff like that? 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Merch, t-shirts, Madow Brothers t-shirts. We met some really cool people in Dothan. If anybody here is listening and you’re in Dothan, Alabama, bring us back and hello. Thanks for having us that one time. It was good. Maybe we should say hi. Didn’t Marshall have a dental assistant from Dothan, Alabama? He did. 
 Dr. David Madow: What was her name? 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Her name was – oh shoot I can’t remember what her name was. I’ll get it, I’ll remember. He used to talk about her all the time. All the time. 
 Dr. David Madow: Oh. How come he’s not with her? 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I’m not sure. I think maybe she moved back to Dothan. My advice is go back to Green Bow, Alabama. We better answer this question
 Dr. David Madow: We better 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Because now we’re running late. 
 Dr. David Madow: No we never run late on the show. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Running late is a bit of a pet peeve of mind. Even though the phrase pet peeve is a bit of a pet peeve of mind. I cannot stand running late. Those of you who have gone to some of our one day seminars, you may have been there when I told you the story about how I left my physician because he ran late all the time. Do any of you think people leave dental practices as patients leave because they run late? 
 Dr. David Madow: 100%. I’ve done it. I’m not going to mention any names because the office might be watching. But seriously, I have actually left a practice because every time I came in for a hygiene appointment, I could like, clockwork, she ran like 15 to 20 minutes late. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Run late like clockwork. It’s funny. 
 Dr. David Madow: It’s true. Like clockwork. I could predict that even if I came in late, once early – I’m always early as you know. Always early and I came in, and I see her like futzing around with a patient every single time. 15 to 20 minutes late. I just got the hell out of there. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: You made an interesting comment which is – I’m not going to mention the name of the practice because they may be listening, which leads to the next point which is you left an office because they were running late all the time. I bet they had no idea that’s why you left. 
 Dr. David Madow: No idea. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Zero Idea. 
 Dr. David Madow: First of all, let’s back up. I’m not ever sure if they know I left. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Right. Problem number one. 
 Dr. David Madow: They have no idea. Should I have told them? 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I don’t know. Maybe.
 Dr. David Madow: It was kind of like a friend of mine. I hate to say. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Yeah. Well Ex-friend. 
 Dr. David Madow: No he’s still a friend and he has no idea that I left. Because of that. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: But it’s interesting, because a dentist might think, yeah we run late. That’s par for the course. Patients aren’t leaving because of it but they are. And they’re certainly not referring other people knowing that their friends or co-workers will have to sit in the reception area collecting dust while they’re waiting to be taken back. 
 Dr. David Madow: Hey Jimmy, I want to refer you to a really good practice. They always run late but they’re really good, but they always run late. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Well I’ll get there late. Yeah not cool. 
 Dr. David Madow: It doesn’t happen. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: So I got to say, and Dave I know when we both had our practices, this is something we talked about. We simply did not run late in my practice. That was the rule. We do not run late. And then when decisions have to be made, emergencies call, procedures go bad as they always do sometimes in dentistry. And we had to make a decision. Our decision was based on the fact that we do not run late. Is it possible? Absolutely. We both did it. 
 Dr. David Madow: Yes, it is possible. I will go back and say that there are a few things that could be done with this doctor. I think when they wrote in – it was a team member that wrote in and she said he just talks way too much, 20 minutes, sometimes – so one thing they can do, I mean two things with that. He could either not talk as much or if he truly loves talking, he’s going to have to realize that he just can’t produce as much and schedule more time for each patient, but you can’t have it both ways. You can’t talk 20 minutes after the appointment is over and continue to see patients. It just doesn’t work. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: So you’re saying this doctor – one of the decisions they might have to make is: do I enjoy talking, or can I not control my talking so much, that I’m going to actually have to reduce my income because I’ve got this talking habit and that way I won’t run late. 
 Dr. David Madow: If the doctor truly is like a dentist… 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Chatter box. 
 Dr. David Madow: Who loved talking to the patients and that’s what he likes to do. He wakes up in the morning thinking, I’m going to have a nice conversation with Mrs. Smith. He’ll have to realize he can’t fit as many patients in which might mean not as much income. Because the other alternative is to consistently run late. The patients are pissed off. They’re going to leave anyway so it’s kind of having the same effect. He’s not going to make as much income because the patients are leaving the practice. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: It might be better to just shut the hell up. Some people, they have a personality that won’t allow them to do that. I know. 
 Dr. David Madow: Right. That would be good but suppose he really likes talking to his patients, suppose he got into dentistry because he loves that part. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I would question, even if this is the case. Do the patients really enjoy sitting in there talking with the dentist? I mean let’s face it. People are busy, they don’t want to have a dentist blab to them for 20 minutes when they’re done. Even if they’re acting like they’re respectful and care – they would rather get out of there, I think. 
 Dr. David Madow: Yeah you might be right. Don’t get me wrong. I do not think that’s the idea of the practice. To pad appointment time because you like talking to your patients for 20 minutes. It’s not ideal at all. It’s not good revenue-wise and financial-wise. Not good. But it’s one solution. But yeah I agree. Cut the chatter down to a minimum, but still be super nice. If my doctor came in and was super nice to me and asked me a question or two and then said they’re off to their next patient. I’d be totally happy with that. I don’t expect my doctor nor want my doctor to be in there talking to me for 20 extra minutes. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Right. You know about my internist. I really really like him. He is – I don’t think it’s even a technique. I don’t even think he realizes that he does it. 
 Dr. David Madow: Does he have a technique? 
 Dr. Richard Madow: When you finish your appointment, he asks like one kind of non-medical, one social question. He knows I love music and he loves European history. He’s super smart. He knows I like talking about that stuff too even though I don’t know that much compared to him. He’ll just bring up one thing, we’ll have a really friendly chit chat for 2 minutes and then we both know it’s time to go. 
 Dr. David Madow: It’s time to go. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: He’s got another patient after. 
 Dr. David Madow: I think that’s ideal. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: And he runs on time which is rare with internists. 
 Dr. David Madow: I think that’s actually ideal… 
 Dr. Richard Madow: But I feel like he cares about me, he knows me as a person, not just a set of organs. But I also feel he doesn’t run late and I appreciate it. Those of you who come to our seminars, one of the little tips I give is that – and it takes me like 30 minutes in our seminar. We will try to do it in 30 seconds. 
 Dr. David Madow: Okay sorry, 30 seconds. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Doc, when you have a bit of spare time, maybe your assistant is making a temporary, patient is getting numb and they’re waiting for an impression. Go into the hygiene room and check your hygiene patient. Make a little deal with your hygienist. We’re not going to do it at the end of the appointment. You don’t have to come track me down and while I’m in the middle of something that I can’t take a break from. I’m going to come in when I have a minute, we’ll do the hygiene check, just sit the patient up, rinse them out, give me the spiel, boom, boom. Hygienist never has to wait for the dentist, dentist never has to wait for the hygienist. That will definitely help add some minutes into your schedule that you didn’t know you had. So that’s one little tip and trick to not running late. 
 Dr. David Madow: Yeah I think that’s really good. And I think – to summarize – I don’t know if we’re finished with this segment or not, but to summarize, it’s really important that the doctor just makes that determination. I don’t know if that’s the best word or not, but we are not going to run late in every single thing that’s done during the course of the day. Goes back to that we do not run late. And if that’s the mindset of the entire practice, like you and I did in our practices, you don’t run late 99.9% of the time. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Well I think a lot of it also has to do with the doctor has unrealistic expectations on how long it takes to do certain procedures. They say, yeah this patient needs two crowns. I’d love to do it as soon as possible. That doesn’t mean you can throw it into a 40-minute slot. It’s just not realistic and that’s asking for trouble. 
 Dr. David Madow: You have to be honest with the scheduling. The amount of time it takes to do a procedure. That’s exactly right. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I’ll tell you another thing too. People say, we have emergencies, we have – if you get a lot of emergencies, that’s a different issue all together. We don’t have that many emergencies in dentistry. We’re not heart surgeons. 
 Dr. David Madow: And when you do have an emergency, that does not mean you have to do a full treatment. A lot of times palliative treatment, diagnose, do what it takes to get them out of pain and bring them back in the time slot that you can actually do the full procedure. It doesn’t mean you have to do everything for an emergency patient; just get them in. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: It also doesn’t mean that that emergency has to take scheduling priority over a patient that has an appointment. You can bring the emergency in and say look, we’re going to take care of you. We have scheduled patients today as well so I might be bopping in and out of the room and you might be here a little bit more. But don’t make the scheduled patient wait. Make the emergency patient wait. Get them pleased as punch that you’re seeing them. So if they have to wait a little bit, they’ll understand. Work in it. 
 Dr. David Madow: I think the bottom line – we can both agree on this. The bottom line is that if you are running late consistently in your practice, it is absolutely hurting your practice. Admit it or not, it is hurting your practice, and the only person or people that can control this is the doctor
 and the team members. You’ve got to determine that we’re going to change this. If you don’t change it, it’s hurting your practice. So it’s up to you. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: As always. 
 Dr. David Madow: Everything is up to you. Exactly. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Okay I don’t to beat this dead horse. 
 Dr. David Madow: Oh please. What? 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I don’t understand why dentists don’t take this advice, because most dentists run late. At least with a decent percentage of their patients. 
 Dr. David Madow: I will tell you this. I go to an office now locally. A dental office locally, and I will tell you they subscribe to our philosophy and she’s probably watching this right now. I won’t even mention names but honestly, they never run late. I walk in for my hygiene appointment, I’m 100% of the time greeted by the hygienist and taken back on time every single time. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: So you know, it’s funny. We both go to dental practices that – not only do we personally know the dentists and really respect their clinical abilities, but they’re really really well-run practices. The practice I go to is a large practice. It has I think five dentists now. I think three or four of them are partners. So it’s a big place and when I go in I’m always greeted by name instantly. And pretty much – and I’m always like five or 10 minutes early, but as soon as I – if I look at my watch, 11 AM on the button, I know my hygienist comes out and greets me. She calls me Dr. Madow which I don’t care if she doesn’t but it’s nice. Everybody else in the waiting room looks, oh what kind of doctor is he. You don’t look like a doctor. But that’s not my point. It sounds like it’s the same way in the practice where you go; you’re greeted by name, on time they take you… 
 Dr. David Madow: [cross talking - 0:13:02.0] when I walk in. No this is really funny. You’ll like this. It’s really cute with the way they do it. But the person behind the front desk, I walk in the door, she looks at me and she said okay the party is about to get started right now. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Well that’s good. 
 Dr. David Madow: It’s good, it’s fun. And people in the waiting room look at you because, who’s that doctor. They look at me like, why is a party starting every time this guy walks in? 
 Dr. Richard Madow: And are they disappointed? 
 Dr. David Madow: I think so. Very disappointed. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Very funny. It can be done. It is being done. It’s being done and if it’s not being done in your practice, it’s being done in your competition’s practice. 
 Dr. David Madow: Both of the practices that we go to are extremely successful practices. And let’s just say one reason could be because they never run late. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: It’s very possible. Alright, well hey, before we get to our call which we’re going to continue with this theme and try to find a dental practice that does not run late. Right before we started recording; I was going to say taping. Taping is one of those terms that it’s not actually going on tape, but we still call it taping. 
 Dr. David Madow: I think it’s taping. We’ll always call it taping. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Kind of like, will you dial this number? You’re not actually dialing. 
 Dr. David Madow: By the way, can you make me – you know those mix tapes you made me in the 1980s, could you make me another mix tape? 
 Dr. Richard Madow: It’s so funny you mentioned that because we don’t make mix tapes these days. We make playlists. 
 Dr. David Madow: Oh playlists. Right. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I’m not bragging you or anything but I think I was known as a legend in the mix tape world. 
 Dr. David Madow: Every time you made a mix tape which then ultimately went into a mix CD. I treasure those things. I’m not kidding. They are really good. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I was actually looking at my storage bin for some of my old mix CDs and mix tapes because I want to now to make them Spotify playlists. And I can’t find it. I threw them all out somehow. You probably don’t have them anymore either, but I was thinking about contacting some of my old friends who I always used to send mix CDs and I know this is a weird question but if you have any of my old mix CDs, please – because I made like inserts with all the song names on them too. Just take a quick photo of the inserts and send them to me. So if any of you are watching, please do that. 
 Dr. David Madow: Let me see what I have. There’s a slight chance on Apple Music. I might have one or two because I know sometimes songs come up and actually the artists, it says – because the way I filled it in, it says Rich Records. Let me see if I can recover… 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Oh wow, that would be great. 
 Dr. David Madow: Let me see if I have any old ones. That would be pretty cool. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I know there’s one that I would really like to have. A couple songs from Sue Mack and one from Death Ray. I’m trying to think of two really cool bands who kind of came and went. 
 Dr. David Madow: Let’s see if I can find something. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Okay. If we find them and I make them, I’ll give the Spotify public link on this podcast. Anyway, right before we started taping, not really taping but digitally recording today, we were talking about Fattmerchant. How unbelievable they are because we use them here at the Madow Center and most of the times where people pay us here for seminars and marketing programs or coaching or whatever, it’s by charge card. 
 So, finding the right charge card vendor, whatever you want to say. Processor which really really important to us. And everybody is calling, oh yeah we’re the bank, we can beat this rate, we can do this, we can do that. So, it really took us a long time before we found Fattmerchant, and we have been so incredibly – make a ding there. Every time we say Fattmerchant, maybe a bell should go off. 
 Dr. David Madow: What’s that bell? 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Doctors Madow just mentioned Fattmerchant. We’ve been incredibly pleased with them. We’re saving a ton of money, their customer service is incredible and we’ve recommended them to so many dental practices who are happily using them. So bottom line is customer service is great. If you use our special landing page /website, you’ll get all the equipment for free. They don’t charge a monthly overage percentage so you’ll save money like crazy. 
 Dr. David Madow: That’s big. That is bigtime. I want to ask you one thing. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: It’s fun to say Fattmerchant because I’m going to make my next ding. 
 Dr. David Madow: Well it’s more like – okay somebody is listening to this or watching us on the video part of it. They might not want to come to TBSE, you have to travel, you might not want to come to our Masterclass, they might not want to buy a product… 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Switch dental labs. 
 Dr. David Madow: Yeah exactly. But is there any reason why somebody wouldn’t switch credit card processing merchants to save a lot of money every single month when it’s almost effortless? I just can’t think of a reason. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: You’re right. You just put the whole thing in place and then boom. You forget it. 
 Dr. David Madow: It’s so easy. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: You set it and forget it. 
 Dr. David Madow: Yeah you set it and forget it. It’s like if somebody is sending you like a check for a lot of money every month for almost doing nothing. I mean it’s crazy not to – yeah well we did it. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Kind of like my friend with a famous job you know about. 
 Dr. David Madow: I still want that job. I really want that job. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: He’s paid 200,000 a year for doing nothing.    
 Dr. David Madow: You told me he does something. But seriously, who wouldn’t want – somebody sends you a big fat check every month for almost doing nothing. I mean that’s one of the reasons we switched to Fattmerchant. It’s the ease of processing it. It’s just so perfect, we love it. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: It’s unbelievable, check it out. Go to this special website or landing page, whatever you want to call it, that we made just for you. When you use this, of course you get a free terminal. Free terminal, is that what it’s called? I think so. 
 Dr. David Madow: Yeah. The box, whatever you want to call that thing. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: The box. Put the message in the box. It Bitly which is B I T.L Y/FATTMAD. F A T T M A D. So it’s bit.ly/fattmad. They even now have a special phone number and I can’t remember what it is. 
 Dr. David Madow: We’ll see if we can get it either in this episode or next week. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Or maybe we can put it in the graphics under there. So special [cross talking - 0:18:37.3]. 
 Dr. David Madow: That will be great. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Fantastic. So do it, no excuse. 
 Dr. David Madow: I’ll say one more thing before we move on to the phone call, but if you’re one of the docs that’s been listening or watching our podcast every week and you hear us mention Fattmerchant and you haven’t done anything yet, let’s make this the episode you’ll finally say yeah I’m in. I want to save a few hundred bucks. I can’t guarantee the amount because it depends on the volume of the practice. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Millions. It could be millions. 
 Dr. David Madow: Well it totally depends on the volume of your – if you’ve got a high volume in your practice, you save a ton – let’s make this the episode where you say, okay I’m going to do it. No excuses because it’s stupid if you don’t do it. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I’m in. All right, good stuff. 
 Dr. David Madow: Let me just mention real quick. We have also been talking about this every other episode. We’ve got a Masterclass coming up this weekend. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Right, and by the time people hear this it’s going too late for this one. 
 Dr. David Madow: And it’s totally full. Totally full. We’re not accepting anybody else. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: No more new patients. 
 Dr. David Madow: But we have some more Masterclasses coming up and Masterclass, let’s just leave it as this. It’s a day where you can absolutely change your practice and change your life. We don’t charge to attend the Masterclass. Come to the Madow Center for Dental Practice Success in Baltimore, Maryland. To get there, go to masterclass.madow.com, check it out. If this is the year you’re changing your practice and improving your life, your revenue, come to our Masterclass. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: All right, see you then. Let’s do our call of the week. 
 Dr. David Madow: Perfect. 
 [phone ringing] 
 Male Speaker: Good morning. How can I help you? 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Hi. Is this a dental office? 
 Male Speaker: This is a dentist office, yes. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Yeah I’ve got a question for you. I’m thinking about switching dentists. The dentist I go to now seems like he’s a good dentist but they always run late. Like every time they take me back 10 minutes late, 15 minutes late. Do you guys usually run on time in your practice? 
 Male Speaker: Usually yes, we do. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Usually yes. How often do you think do you don’t?
 Male Speaker: I mean we don’t schedule over because we only have one doctor that works every day so we’re usually pretty much on time. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Okay great. Good, well thank you so much for that information. 
 Male Speaker: You’re very welcome. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Okay bye. 
 Male Speaker: Bye, bye. 
 Dr. David Madow: Oh wow. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Well first of all, how did that guy answer the phone… 
 Dr. David Madow: Wait a minute, was it a guy? It was not a guy. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: How did the woman answer the phone? 
 Dr. David Madow: What do you think it was? You think it was a guy? 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I’m not sure. I’m not going to go there. 
 Dr. David Madow: Might have been a mature woman I think. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I’m not going to go there. 
 Dr. David Madow: What did she say, dentist office or something? 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I really couldn’t tell but it might have been [cross talking - 0:21:14.1] 
 Dr. David Madow: And then you said is this a dental office, this is a dentist office. Just like that. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: That was one of the more mumbly unlistenable answers I’ve ever heard in a long time. Exactly. Bad way to answer the phone. 
 Dr. David Madow: So that’s a strike against her. I think it was a her… 
 Dr. Richard Madow: [inaudible - 0:21:34.9] 
 Dr. David Madow: I think we can call back and say are you a her or… 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Nah I don’t have the number. 
 Dr. David Madow: Okay. I think she handled the answer to the question pretty well. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: I totally agree. I mean it was exactly what somebody want to hear. We try our best to run on time. We usually do. That’s as much as you’re going to expect. 
 Dr. David Madow: Yeah it was really good. But… 
 Dr. Richard Madow: We’d love to make an appointment for you so we can show you how well we run on time, Anything, please. 
 Dr. David Madow: It just goes back to every single episode is that the doctor probably thinks that his front desk person is doing a great job with scheduling but this is an example that she got no information, did not ask would you like to set up an appointment. Nothing, zero. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Right. No information. Could not even call back if she wanted to. 
 Dr. David Madow: No way. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: Zippo. That is a big, fat F. 
 Dr. David Madow: I’m going to have to agree. F. 
 Dr. Richard Madow: All right. Well don’t run late and we’re not going to run late so we’re going to have to end this episode of the Dental Practice Fixers Podcast. Thanks so much for listening. I’m Dr. Richard Madow. 
 Dr. David Madow: Dr. David Madow. See you next time.       

I Need New Patients!

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The most common desire of all dentists is obtaining more new patients. Tons and tons of them. Docs think that this is the magic fix – you get more new patients and you are automatically successful. Is this true? In today’s episode The Dental Practice Fixers tackle this issue. They dive really deep into it. The answer may not be what you think. Tune in to find out what Dr. David Madow and Dr. Richard Madow have to say about this. Then of course we do the call of the week. We call an office asking a fairly simple question – How much is a cleaning? Most offices totally mess up this straightforward question. What’s your bet? Do they get it right today or not? You need to listen to this one. If you have a question that you would like answered on our podcast, please send it in to podcast@madow.com. We will do our best to get yours answered!


I Need New Patients!

Dr.  Richard Madow:  This is one of the questions we get about practice building problems more than  anything else. And it just happens to be the question for episode 16, season  two of the Dental Practice Fixers Podcast. I'm your cohost, Dr. Richard Madow.
  
  Dr. David Madow: I am Dr. David  Madow. How are you guys doing? 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: How's everybody?  Thanks so much for being with us today. We really appreciate you. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: And thanks so much  for being a follower, listener, whatever you want to call it, fan of the  Dental Practice Fixers whenever you're listening
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: Friend or the  devil. Whether you're listening on iTunes, Stitcher, Spotify, right from our  website, or maybe you're even watching us on YouTube. Pass the word. Give us a  good rating, do what you can to help out the podcast. It's really good for  everyone and for the whole dental community, so we appreciate you. Thanks. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: Let's get right  into it today. Today's question is really not even a question. It's a  statement. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: A statement? 
  
  Dr. David Madow: It's a statement  from Scott in Illinois and his statement is four words. Just, 'I need new  patients'. I think he wants the Dental Practice Fixers to help him. I need new  patients. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: We're going to  do, right? 
  
  Dr. David Madow: We, that's like  probably the most common like, I wouldn't say its complaints, but the most  common desire of a dentist. They say, you know why? Because they think that  if, if I get more new patients, everything in my practice would be fantastic,  all great.
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: I just want a  big bus that says new patients on the side, they pull up to my office and they  all get out and their teeth are just dangling everywhere. They've got  insurance, that's going to be my dream. It will solve everything. You know  what, we try to keep these somewhat brief. I think we could probably do a  five-hour podcasts on this, but we're not going to do it. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: I got time. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: I know, I know. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: We're going to  keep this brief. We're going to answer the question for sure. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: I think there  were a bunch of different things we can say about this. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: Oh definitely. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: One is that  people think they need new patients, but it's not always the answer. An  example would be, I have practice and I need new patients and we look more  deeply into the practice. Maybe one of our coaches, maybe they're a coaching  client, one of our coaches goes out there and sees that they've got tons of  diagnosed treatment just sitting in the charts of patients they already have.  And the problem is they could get all the new patients in the world, but they're  having trouble getting the patients to say yes, I want this treatment you  recommended. So, their overhead is really high. They've got a revolving door  of patients who aren't getting any treatment done. And they think more new  patients is the answer when clearly, it's not. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: Exactly. And  another example would be, yeah, I suppose they want patients they’re not that  busy. But we go in there and we find out that every time the phone rings, the  person or the people at the front desk totally mess up the call. They're not  really good at scheduling, getting people in for appointments so they can get  all the calls, they get called all day long, every single day, every week,  every month. But the person, the front desk is not turning those calls into  appointments. So that's a tremendous problem. We see that more often than not.  
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: Well, we  certainly demonstrate that just about every week on the Dental Practice  Fixers; our typical mystery shopper call is some kind of new patient calling  with a question, one version or another of saying, I've selected your  practice. I want to become a patient in your practice. And there was, you  know, a typical question, whether it's how much do you charge for cleaning or  can you tell me where you're located or do you do crowns here? You know,  you've been listening for a while and they cannot get the new patient off the  phone and into the appointment book. So that's certainly a problem. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: So sometimes,  okay. Yeah, I think you're right. We can make this five hours if we wanted to  go, but we’re not going to. Suffice it to say there are a lot of things that  need to be in place and working really well in your practice before you even  should say, I need more new patients because these basic things should be  working really well, but let's assume they are.
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: I just want to  settle for one second and say kind of in agreeance to that is we help  practices get new patients. As a matter of fact, we have a whole Total New  Patient Program that people are using successfully, but unless your office's  in order, we would never recommend to spend money on marketing or referral  programs or whatever it is to get new patients because you'll just have a  repeat of the same issue. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: Exactly. To make  it, we should do this. Let's talk about some of the things that docs should  not do when looking for more patients. In other words, too many docs that we  know, that we've seen, that we've worked with. Those who typically, there'll  be walking around a dental meeting and of course there will be that big  exhibit hall. They'll go from exhibit to exhibit and everybody there, you  know, if they're not doing something clinical, everybody there is saying, I  can get you more new patients, here's how we do it, without a real plan,  without really thinking this thing through. They just sign up for these  different programs all and there. It's a mess. They're basically what we used  to say, like they're just throwing spaghetti at the wall, hopefully something  will stick. Well, that is the worst thing possible. You need a plan. You can't  just start saying, I want new patients. Let's take a little here, a little  there. It just doesn't work. It's going to mess you up. We promise that. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: Well, I think  typically, you know, a dentist necessarily walking through a big meeting or  maybe even TBSE and we'll come across a booth and some person that will say,  I'm going to get you on the front page of Google. That's first of all, it's  one of those promises that you gotta get your radar up a little bit. When  somebody promises to get you on the front page of Google every time. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: we want to say,  easier said than done, I think. I say, well, 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: What if they  were on the front page of Google? So much more to it. Then when somebody  clicks on that listing, where does it go? Where does it take you, to a landing  page, to a website? What's on that landing page? What's on the website? Is  there a good call to action? Is the person at the other end of the phone  capable of scheduling these patients? As we've talked about, there's so many  steps that go into it,
  
  Dr. David Madow: Are you able to  track? are you following up with print, postcards, mail, whatever? There are  so many components of this, it's unbelievable. On the other side of the coin,  I feel that we're getting all over the place here, 
  
  Dr. David Madow: But that's what we  do. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: That's what the  Fixers do. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: We do as what we  do. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: There are  practices who really are good practices and have a lot of things in order, but  they are completely invisible. They're doing nothing to get new patients and  just hoping, hoping, hoping that the old method of word of mouth will work for  them and that can be a mistake as well. So, this very complicated. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: What did our  little friend, Dr. Mitchell Josephs say about word of mouth? 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: It make W O M.  Wooooom.
  
  Dr. David Madow: It's like an air  conditioner running in the background. It's slow. Wooooom
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: It's mixed up  noise. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: It's all word of  mouth. I think word of mouth is great and the more patients we get through  word of mouth, but it cannot be the only way you get patients. There's no way.  So, what's the best, this wasn't even a question, but what's the best way to  kind of finalize this? I need more new patients. Number one, I guess. Make  sure, make sure everything in your practice is working. And from what we've  seen, I will go on record and say chances are it's not because how many times  have we or our coaches gone into a practice that supposedly everything is  great, everything is fantastic, we just need more new patients and we see  some… 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: Everything's not  fantastic. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: It's not. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: So, I think  maybe, I don't know if we're ready to conclude the topic or not, but I think a  conclusion could be before you even think about any program to get new  patients, make sure everything is in order in your house, so to speak. And  that means that you are treating patients really, really well. That patient  feels like this is their dental home and it's warm and there's trust and they  know that when they go in there, they're going to meet a team that calls them  by name and runs on time and is kind and makes sure they're comfortable and  calls at night to see how they're doing. All these things need to be in place  before you even start thinking about new patient strategies because if they're  not, they just simply won't work. And how's your treatment plan acceptance  rate and do you have a soft tissue management program like we talked about on  the last episode, all of these things need to be taken care of first. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: Yeah, there are a  lot of things, but let's say, but once they're taken care of and once you need  new patients, which maybe we'll do a shameless plug for our Total New Patient  Program. 
    
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Why not? 
  
  Dr. David Madow: It's our Total New  Patient Program. You know why? 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: TNPP. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: You know why?  Because we have been, and this wasn't planned, but we've been helping dentists  get new patients for well over 30 years. Actually, before we became the Madow  Brothers. Well, wait, we've been Madow Brothers for life.
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: You we're not a  Madow brother like 1955 to a mid-1957.
  
  Dr. David Madow: Yeah. There was no  Madow Brothers, just Madow. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: And then  Marshall was born. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: And that's a  whole, you can do five hours on that. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: Then we became  the Madow Brothers, not this Madow Brothers nonetheless. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: But before we  actually started the Madow Brothers, Creative Management Resources with our  collection forms and the newsletter. I think before that, a couple of years  before that we started helping dentists get new patients into the practice, so  we've been using 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: Using the same  things we did in our practices. So, we know it works.  
    
  Dr.  David Madow:  I'd say it's safe to say we've been doing this new patient thing longer than  anybody in dentistry for 30 plus years, well over 30 years, we're close to 35  years now. We know what we're doing and we now have and we're always changing.  We're always updating and we have this thing called Total New Patient Program  or Total New Patient Plan. It's TNPP. Total New Patient Program, I think it  stands for. Anyway, it doesn't matter what it stands for. The bottom line is  it's going to get more new patients. You know why? Because we do many  different things. It's not just one thing. We have not only an online presence  but follow up with postcards. We have tracking numbers. We do so many things  for you. Facebook, targeted Facebook ads. We target all ads. We know what  we're doing, we've done this a long time, we're up to date and if you need  more new patients and you've got everything else in place in your practice,  you might want to look into the Total New Patient Program. Best way is just go  to Madow.com. 
    
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  There's something else came to mind, talking about that and you were talking  about going to the big convention in Chicago, TBSE whatever. There are a lot  of dentists also, we hate to see dentists spend money irresponsibly or where  they don't get a good return on their investment. And so many times I want to  come into the clinical end of things, dentists think.
  
  Dr. David Madow: I know exactly  where you're going with this. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: They're going to  buy some clinical gadget that's going to change everything. We actually had  somebody a couple years ago, we really liked this guy, a great guy. And he  called us because he was thinking about using us for coaching. And the call  kind of elevated us, and I remember we're on the phone with him several times  and he was deciding between utilizing us for coaching or buying some piece of  equipment. Neither of us had ever heard of it, we started calling it the pain  machine. It was like someone has some kind of facial pain, TMJ Syndrome,  whatever, you just hold this machine up to their face and it magically cures  the pain which does not work. That's a topic for another day. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: Back up for a  second. We've got to say that his practice was not what I would call a  successful practice. It was in disarray. He was in his early sixties I  believe, he had basically no retirement, no money saved, very, very, very bad  financial shape and he was sold a bill of goods. This company told him that if  he just does this thing, he's going to be like the pain guy in his area. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: They convinced  him to buy all of this equipment went down to Florida, told us in Florida and  took the courses. Patients will be camped out and he would like, he'd get  there in the morning, have to like shuffle his way through the patients in  sleeping bags with bandages on their heads.
  
  Dr. David Maddow: Next, next, next.  
  
  Dr. Richard Maddow: exactly when he  opens the door. And he decided to go with that instead of getting some  coaching. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: Hadn't worked out. 
    
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Well we actually followed up and he was hesitant to admit that, I hate to say  we were right, but he was hesitant to admit that this was not the solution to  those problems. Not just a dusty piece of equipment 
  
  Dr. David Madow: He's paying on it.  He's paying by the month for like the next 60 months, he's got to pay on this  thing. It was very expensive and it hasn't helped his practice one bit. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: So, a lot of  times people ask us like, is a CEREC a piece of equipment I should buy? We're  not anti-CEREC in principle, it's a really cool thing to be able to make  crowns if you know, if you're clinically talented to be able to make crowns  for your patients the same day as you prep, that's cool. But will the whatever  $100,000 you spend bring more patients in your practice, well that's a  different story all together. 
    
  Dr. David Madow: And unless you've got a $100,000  to $150,000 in cash lying around that you can just spend taking out a note and  going into debt for this. And then you find the thing doesn't work as well.  Look, let me tell you something. It's possible. It just possibly might not  work out as well as the company says it's going to. And then you're paying on  this thing forever for a $100,000, $150,000 piece of equipment that really  hasn't worked. It turns into a mess. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: We're not  telling you this piece of equipment or technology will do this, this, and  this. Well that's, you know, that's great. What it'll do clinically, how it  will help your patients make them feel better, smile better, get their  appointments more efficiently, whatever, that stuff might be true. But when  they say, and this will grow your practice like crazy. Well-
  
  Dr. David Madow: I'd be cautious.  So, when they break it down it's like a five year note or whatever it is.  Something like five-year note, ten-year note, whatever it might be. And they  say the payment’s only $1,800 a month. So, doctor, all you need to do is one  case per month and it takes care of this. That's bullshit because it's not as  easy as it sounds and that's for every single month for the next 60 months  plus. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: Use the pain  machine three times per month and-
  
  Dr. David Madow: Please don't  succumb to that kind of stuff. Please don't. Call us 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: Talk to us  first, you know, call us, send us an email. We'll be glad to help you with  that even though you probably already know what our opinion is. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: Dr. Scott, I hope  that helps. We answered it, we went into a lot of detail, maybe gave you some  things you didn't even want to hear about, but we hope that helps you, so we  do the call. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: Let's do the  call, I just want to talk about real, real quickly cause it's coming up before  you know it, that's TBSE in Las Vegas, The Best Seminar Ever for dentists and  team members. You've probably heard about it on several podcasts. I won't go  into that much detail except to say if you are looking for an incredible  continuing education experience and a really fun time and some fantastic  practice growth information, you got to come to The Best Seminar Ever. So just  go to TBSE.com, tuition is still low, still seats left, but it will sell out  and the prices will go up. So, sign up now for TBSE. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: And we'll be  there, right? 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: I sure hope so.  Barring any unforeseen circumstances. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: Before we do the  call, real quick well, since we're trying to really help your practice, we've  got just a couple of things real quickly we'll run by you. Number one is if  you're taking credit card payments in your practice for treatment, there is a  way to save a lot of money, maybe a little bit, a little to a lot of money  every single month very easily by pretty much, pretty much a push of a button.  It's called Fattmerchant. We love them, we believe in them, we use them here  at the Madow Center for Dental Practice Success. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: We save money  here. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: So again, if you  could save $20 a month or $5,000 a month, not promising either of those, but  somewhere in the middle. What can you do, it's very simple, we've got a  special site set up for you. It's simply bit.ly/fattmad. The reason you should  go to that site in particular is because when you do, they will give you,  since you're a friend of the Madows and you listened to our podcast or watched  our podcast, they're going to give you a free terminal, right? 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: Yup.
  
  Dr. David Madow: Ordinarily you  have to pay for this, but they give it to you free. So, it's a no-lose  situation. It's so simple and it's a way you can bring in some extra money or  save some extra money in your practice every single month. Go to  bit.ly/fattmad. If you're watching the video on YouTube, it's right there,  make sure to click it right there, guys. And also, since you're watching us,  we are the Dental Practice Fixers, if you really want to take your practice,  things to the next level, attend one of our Masterclasses. Come out, hang out  with me, with Rich, with our coaches and our Madow Center for Dental Practice  Success in Baltimore. It's a full day of really great learning. We'll share  with you how we can help increase your practice, increase your revenue, increase  your happiness. Go to masterclass.madow.com and again if you're watching us,  it's right there. There'll be that link. Masterclass is very small and every  single one of them has sold out. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: So, we've met  some fantastic people and it's great when we hear somebody, a few months  later, from somebody a few months later saying, that Masterclass I attended  was a true turning point for me. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: Changed my life. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: My practice is  doing better, I'm happier, I'm making more money, I have a cohesive team.  That's the kind of stuff that really makes us happy after doing this for over  30 years. So, we’d love to have you be one of those people contacting us a few  months from now saying it was a day that really helped turn things around. See  you at the Masterclass. And what about the call? Let's do the call. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: Who do you want to  call? Let's do it right now. 
    
  Caller: Good morning. Thank you for  calling, [inaudible] Kayla speaking. who do I have the pleasure speaking with? 
    
  Dr.  David Madow: Hi  Kayla, this is Michael calling. I've been looking for a new dentist for a  little while and I don't know the exact question I should be asking, so I  guess I should just ask how much is a cleaning? 
    
  Caller: Okay. May I ask when's the last  time you had a cleaning?
  
  Dr. David Madow: It's been about a  year or so. 
    
  Caller: Okay. And when was the last time  you were seen by a dentist? 
    
  Dr.  David Madow:  About the same. 
  
  Caller: About a year ago? 
  
  Dr. David Madow: Yeah. 
    
  Caller: Okay. Well we could definitely  help you out. May I ask how you heard about us? 
    
  Dr.  David Madow:  Just an internet search. 
    
  Caller: Okay. Well we can definitely help  you out here in the office. I will let you know in order for the doctor to let  you know what type of cleaning you would need; doctor needs to do a full exam  of your mouth. Also do some x-rays that so that we'll know what type of  cleaning you would need, diagnose you properly. But I will let you know that  cleanings are going to range from a more basic cleaning of about a hundred  dollars to a more deeper cleaning, which is a couple hundred. 
    
  Dr.  David Madow:  Okay. Okay. And that sounds pretty reasonable, that answered the question  there. Good. 
  
  Caller: When will you like to come  in? 
  
  Dr. David Madow: I wasn't sure.  I'll just kind of still trying to figure my life out basically, my dental life  I should say. 
  
  Caller: - Figuring out your life  though. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: My dental life,  you know. 
    
  Caller: Okay. Well, do you have a good  telephone number where I could follow up with you? 
    
  Dr.  David Madow:  Sure. I do. Sure. Okay. I'm from out of town, so it's 801-484-4297. 
    
  Caller: Okay, we'll definitely follow up  with you. Definitely want to make sure you're still having your dental  treatment done. Okay? 
    
  Dr.  David Madow:  That sounds great. Tell me your name one more time. I want to just write that  down. 
  
  Caller: My name is Kayla. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: That's what I  thought, Kayla. Thank you so much, Kayla. I really appreciate it. 
    
  Caller: No problem. Enjoy the rest of  your day. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: Thank you.  Goodbye. 
  
  Caller: Thanks, bye, bye. 
    
  Dr.  Richard Madow:  Wow, Kayla.
  
  Dr. David Madow: Kayla, what do you  think? 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: I'm going to say  we might have like our first non-failure in a long time. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: To be fair because  we want to make sure our listeners and viewers know that we do a call and if  it's, most of them that are not good, but if it's a good one we don't censor,  we don't delete that. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: We'll give Kayla  some credit. She did a lot of things I like. No, this is not exactly how we  recommend to answer the phone, but I like how she said, who do I have the  pleasure of speaking with? They're friendly, personal. I thought that was a  good line. She said a lot that I liked, when she kept saying, I can definitely  help you out. It was good, very reassuring. I can definitely help you out. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: One thing that,  again, it's probably not exactly how we teach, but she did it, she did it  okay. She pretty much didn't really, she gave him a fee for a cleaning, but  she said, it sounds like they’re an office where you have to have an exam  first. In other words, you can't come in just for a cleaning and exam. You've  got to have the exam before they even tell you what kind of cleaning. A lot of  people, including us, will probably say that might not be the best way to do  it because if somebody wants to come in for a cleaning, let them come in for a  cleaning and then of course let them become your patient and you can diagnose  them at that point. But that is a hurdle for some people not being able to  have a cleaning on the first visit. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: I think maybe a  patient has asked for a fee right off the bat like that. Maybe with that she  felt more comfortable saying, well, let's get you an exam first and we can  give you the exact fee. Maybe if you say, I just want to have a cleaning, she  would have [00:21:07]. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: Very possible.
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: I like how also  we always recommend 2 good choices just like we'd love to see you as a patient  in our practice. We can see you tomorrow at 2:00 PM or Thursday at 11:00 AM,  which is best for you? She didn't do that, but she has a cool version of it.  She said, well, when are you looking to come in? I like that because whenever  you said, she could've said, perfect, I'll see you then. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: It's also good  because it's, you just even with just saying that, she's better than 98 to 99%  of the offices in the country that we call because usually we don't get to  that point. Usually they don't say, when would you like to come in and can I  schedule you an appointment? They just say, okay, thank you, bye. So, and then  she asked for my name, she wanted to make sure she got my name and my phone  number. She made it clear that she's going to call me bac she's very concerned  about my dental care. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: So, whoever  actually has that number's going to get a call from Kayla. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: Don't call that  number. I think she did a good job. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: I totally agree.  
  
  Dr. David Madow: I do. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: If we have to  grade her, what are you going to give her? 
  
  Dr. David Madow: Oh, I'm going to  have, well, I'll tell you, I'm going to have to give her an A. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: I'm going to  give her an A as well. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: Because there's  nothing that she did wrong, I mean, okay. We might not agree on the philosophy  of the cleaning on the first visit, but she did a great job and I'm going to  give her the A for sure. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: Kayla, you got  an A, possibly the first A in the history of the Dental Practice Fixers.  Congratulations. Hey, thanks everybody for listening or watching. This was  episode 15 or 16, 
  
  Dr. David Madow: Episode 16. 
  
  Dr. Richard Madow: I never get that  right. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: It's okay, it's  all right, it's all good as they say. 
    
  Dr. Richard Madow: Episode Sweet 16 of the Dental  Practice Fixers Podcast, season two. I'm Dr. Richard Madow. 
  
  Dr. David Madow: Dr. David Madow,  we'll see you next time.